Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

[Dannie Boy]

I may be proved wrong but I don’t think they mean when the money was earned, it’s all about the dates you transferred the money to Thailand.


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[404cameljockey]

The flaw in that argument is they did not get wealthy by spending their money. So if they are excluded from tax, what is the benefit?

Well not all wealthy people are misers, far from it. I lived 12 years in Dubai, I saw expats spending insane amounts. They will spend their money in Thailand on lavish houses, cars (sold when the ashtrays are full), high-end restaurants, luxury goods, salaried staff and all the rest. That's how they pay tax and also heat the economy. A friend of mine here usually either buys new cars each year for himself and his wife, or gives her his 'old' one if she likes it.

I've always hated that you are taxed on income, and what's left is taxed again when you spend it. But that's the world, world economies would collapse without it.

[thecolonel]

DB - I genuinely hope you are wrong then, as if the tax advisor at the recent event reported by Asean Now is correct then I'm in the clear and suspect many others will be too.

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[Big Boy]

No, there will always be exceptions, but many will be here, living a relatively cheap life, with their money earning tax free interest somewhere other than Thailand.

[PeteC]

It's when the money is earned. There's reference to it in many articles and on this thread as well. If it was earned before the current tax laws went into force taxes don't apply.

How do you prove it? You don't, if they want let them audit you and then the person can provide adequate proof.

If the person is over 65 it's pretty obvious that they don't have any income any longer except perhaps some kind of pension that may or may not be taxable. That's why to my thinking they should leave most older visa holders alone.

[hhinner]

It's when the money is earned. There's reference to it in many articles and on this thread as well. If it was earned before the current tax laws went into force taxes don't apply.

How do you prove it? You don't, if they want let them audit you and then the person can provide adequate proof.

If the person is over 65 it's pretty obvious that they don't have any income any longer except perhaps some kind of pension that may or may not be taxable. That's why to my thinking they should leave most older visa holders alone.

"It's when the money is earned."

This used to be the case. I think this is no longer the case. It's just when the money is transferred to Thailand. Anything transferred to Thailand after 1/1/24 is assessable.

This web site is very helpful and has links to revenue department original pronouncements (in Thai).

https://www.expattaxthailand.com/thaila ... ed-income/

[Dannie Boy]

Seems to make sense and was what I had said - it’s when you remit the money to Thailand not when it was earned.


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[malcolminthemiddle]

Anything transferred to Thailand after 1/1/24 is assessable.

Unless it is exempt?

[PeteC]

Read the below and then we can decide if we have conflicting instructions being published? For the moment I give up.

https://www.expattaxthailand.com/taxati ... -thailand/

[Dannie Boy]

Although there may be some discrepancies between the advice, the common theme is about pensions (or potentially any money) may be subject to Thai taxation if it is remitted to Thailand. There are a number of other caveats, but they both agree about only remitted monies being considered.

[hhinner]

Read the below and then we can decide if we have conflicting instructions being published? For the moment I give up.

https://www.expattaxthailand.com/taxati ... -thailand/

Have to agree. Traditional ambiguity in Thai laws and regulations.

[hhinner]

Anything transferred to Thailand after 1/1/24 is assessable.

Unless it is exempt?

OK. But best to have the records available if ever audited.

[404cameljockey]

Anything transferred to Thailand after 1/1/24 is assessable.

Unless it is exempt?

OK. But best to have the records available if ever audited.

Yes it's best to keep your records, either physical or files on your computer. As Thailand is signatory to the world agreement where authorities can share records internationally it's better to be in control of the data they want than let them get raw data from authorities and cause confusion.

[Big Boy]

OK guys, I've been to the tax office, and my initial visit was quite painless. I have a follow-up appointment for 14 Feb.

They do have notices everywhere stating they speak Thai. If you don't speak Thai, take a Thai speaker with you. In reality, there is a lady who speaks reasonable English, and all Farangs were being directed to her. She was very nice, very helpful, but, of course, she has a job to do. I won't say I liked everything she said to me, but she was saying it as it was. The mists have certainly cleared for me.

I will post a detailed report, hopefully today, which details what is needed. Of course, my requirements may be different to other people, and please remember, it was my first visit - I may have become confused. I would certainly recommend others to pay a visit if they can.

Please watch this space for a more detailed report. I think I even understand how the tax treaty bit works now (the bit I didn't like).

[Big Boy]

Disclaimer………. This is my personal experience of today’s visit. Everybody’s circumstances are different, and I may have remembered some of the visit incorrectly. I have written this report to show that the process is nothing to be afraid of, and commend everybody to make a similar visit.

TIN

The first thing that surprised me is they want my (Thai) wife’s details as well. I will comment purely on what I need to produce, but on the attached listings provided, my wife’s requirements are indicated in red (she already has a TIN, so isn’t included on this list).

I have to provide:

• A valid passport
• A valid visa
• My Yellow Book + Pink ID Card (not sure what happens if you don’t have this)
• My wife’s Tabien Baan Blue Book (not sure what happens if living in rented accommodation)
• My (Thai) wife’s ID Card
• Our marriage certificate (I explained we were married in the UK and asked if a translation was required. I was told no.

I note on the list, Health and Life Insurance documents are mentioned. The lady didn’t mention either, but I think both are tax deductible, so if you have them, take them.

TIN.jpg (53.15 KiB) Viewed 2520 times

For Filing Personal Income Tax

I have to provide:

• A bank statement showing all foreign income for 2024
• A valid passport
• A valid visa
• My Yellow Book (not sure what happens if you don’t have this)
• My (Thai) wife’s ID Card
• Our marriage certificate (I explained we were married in the UK and asked if a translation was required. I was told no.

All of the above seems fairly straightforward.

At this stage, the lady demonstrated how my tax would be calculated. We used a monthly income figure of 75,000฿ per month. My annual tax would be in the region of 26,500฿ per annum.

I then raised the tax treaty question. When she saw how much UK tax I pay, she smiled, and said if I use that, I will never have to pay Thai Tax. However, she said, “If”. I asked why she was saying if. She said if I want to use that (and she agreed that I should), I had to get confirmation from the British Embassy that my P60 was genuine. After the Annual income debacle with the British Embassy, that has raised a little doubt in my mind. I will tackle that issue with the Embassy next week. My other doubt is the differing Tax year between Thailand and the UK. My latest P60 only certifies me up until April 2024. I did not ask that question.

Personal Income Tax.jpg (54.1 KiB) Viewed 2520 times

Conclusion

There is certainly nothing to be afraid of in making at least an exploratory visit. The lady was extremely nice, and very helpful. I got the impression she knew what she was doing. OK, I have a bit of work to do before the 14th February, but the mists have cleared, and I’m quite happy to give it a go. I genuinely commend a similar visit to anybody else who was as unsure as I was before today.