Did the items ever return?barrys wrote:
A slightly different slant on "greng jai" from my own experience.
Not long ago I saw somebody leaving our place with our electric angle grinder, drill and a few other tools.
I asked our housekeeper what was going on and she explained that a relative of our skipper had come to borrow some tools.
As I was home at the time I felt I should have been consulted and asked why the person didn't come to me personally as the owner of the items.
The reply was - you guessed it - that the person concerned was "greng jai", presumably meaning that out of overwhelming consideration for my feels they felt it better to take the things without my permission or knowledge.
Is that a cop out or what?
Greng Jai
-
dr dave soul monsta
- Deceased
- Posts: 1281
- Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 10:04 pm
- Location: Altissima quaeque flumina minimo sono labi
- Contact:
"I don't often agree with the RSPCA as i believe it is an animals duty to be on my plate at supper time"
I had one of my drills borrowed and then lent to another fisherman i made it crystal clear that was a no goer 
(it has not happened since) however 2 hours later the 2nd borrower came to me and humbly returned the drill minus the chuck key i asked where it was he immediately jumped on his bike with drill and returned 45 mins later having baught a new chuck key the next day he returned the original chuck key its a funny old world but he has become a friend and uses my tools quite regularly to repair his boat now and we always get a few crabs when he returns tools 
(it has not happened since) however 2 hours later the 2nd borrower came to me and humbly returned the drill minus the chuck key i asked where it was he immediately jumped on his bike with drill and returned 45 mins later having baught a new chuck key the next day he returned the original chuck key its a funny old world but he has become a friend and uses my tools quite regularly to repair his boat now and we always get a few crabs when he returns tools A Greatfull Guest of Thailand
-
barrys
- Legend
- Posts: 2295
- Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 1:52 pm
- Location: Enjoying the sea air on a boat around Pak Nam Pran
Once lent a nearly new drill to a carpenter who was building our pontoons at the time.
When it hadn't been returned after a couple of weeks I asked him about it.
He said that it had stopped working and he had taken it for repair and the shop had sent it to Bangkok??!!
Still seem him now and again and ask him about the drill but he just smiles and mumbles - long repair job, over 18 months now .....
When it hadn't been returned after a couple of weeks I asked him about it.
He said that it had stopped working and he had taken it for repair and the shop had sent it to Bangkok??!!
Still seem him now and again and ask him about the drill but he just smiles and mumbles - long repair job, over 18 months now .....
I overheard my wife use GRENG JAI on the phone this morning.
The original post by Buksida and the many other comments had left me totally confused as to what it meant.
Queues, Music, Borrowing tools, Road rage etc!!
My in laws have been doing some work for us with fence building and erecting spirit houses. She was thanking them and this is when I heard her use the words.
So I asked her and daughter (who is quite well educated) what it meant.
GRENG means something like hard. I dont think there is an English equivelant.
When used with JAI It means.
Obliged to return a favour. Beholden to someone.
In my wifes discussion she was saying that I was GRENG JAI to them for all the things they were doing for me.
This seams to contradict most of the previous posts
The original post by Buksida and the many other comments had left me totally confused as to what it meant.
Queues, Music, Borrowing tools, Road rage etc!!
My in laws have been doing some work for us with fence building and erecting spirit houses. She was thanking them and this is when I heard her use the words.
So I asked her and daughter (who is quite well educated) what it meant.
GRENG means something like hard. I dont think there is an English equivelant.
When used with JAI It means.
Obliged to return a favour. Beholden to someone.
In my wifes discussion she was saying that I was GRENG JAI to them for all the things they were doing for me.
This seams to contradict most of the previous posts
You only live once.
Greng jai
As for who buys the drinks, I have been out in Hua Hin (for example, to the Hilton night club) with groups of bgs and others where it has been most usual for everyone to put in together for a large draught beer.usual suspect wrote:So Parahandy..
...you suggest I get out there and see the real Thailand eh?
Well while I was here on my 14 day trip to the LOS, I did go to the
floating market on a bus trip...does that count?
Oh, I also went to a waterfall and rode an elephant does that count as
the 'real' Thailand?
Err, I think over the years I stand by what I say about the Thais, maybe
you just keep getting sucked-in by their nice nature..(so who pays for
the beer and Thai whiskey when you visit the 'Real Thailand'..bet its
you pal.
And I'm very sorry to hear the family buffalo is sick again...maybe it will
feel better now you bought them a new Isuzu to ferry it around in!!!)
Got to go...up early in mornin'...got some tigers to see on my last
day , bus leaves at 6,00am.
In Bang Saphan I have had difficulty paying at all when out with Thai friends, because of the custom that the highest status person pays for all.
It got to the point where I had to insist that it was my turn to pay - and once, negotiate that I would repay after we left, so that the local big man would not lose face by me paying.
santabanjo
buying beer is quite simple from my experience
if they consider you to be way better off, they will quite often ask in a embarrassed/jokingly way, who is paying. I first experienced this in bangkok when me and herself invited a girl to dinner (barbeque) and she replied "are you paying", on a yes she smiled and that was entire reply.
If you are drinking with thais who have a good basic income (e.g. 15,000 plus) they may try to buy everything or half at least.
If you are with somebody who is a boss, owner, etc, of something fixed ( not a taxi, noodle cart / rather bar, guesthouse , factory, fishing fleet) then if you attempt to pay you are entering high stakes poker, If you pay this time then the next meal will be somewhere more upmarket, and they pay, then its your call again, so best to let them pay and maybe a nice present for their kids or something.
On queing, this is a northern european idea, and assumes everybody is in an equal hurry, though i have been to an english night club and mcdonalds afterwards and did not see any attempt at normal queing. I remember spanish friends lauhghing non stop when i told how a swiss friend braked to stop at a red light, rather than just drive through, it just is a different mindset.
I think thais are too polite to us and each other, allowing the few who are ill mannered to behave as they do.
My wife gets really annoyed by some thais behaviour but never says anything to them.
Off the tourist tracks people are more polite, i get the impression in hua hin some thais regard farangs as essentially a nusiance, but a necessary one, so they behave in a manner not normal in thailand.
As to unmannerly bar girls, well, really,
they should all go to finishing school after graduating like they do in europe
if they consider you to be way better off, they will quite often ask in a embarrassed/jokingly way, who is paying. I first experienced this in bangkok when me and herself invited a girl to dinner (barbeque) and she replied "are you paying", on a yes she smiled and that was entire reply.
If you are drinking with thais who have a good basic income (e.g. 15,000 plus) they may try to buy everything or half at least.
If you are with somebody who is a boss, owner, etc, of something fixed ( not a taxi, noodle cart / rather bar, guesthouse , factory, fishing fleet) then if you attempt to pay you are entering high stakes poker, If you pay this time then the next meal will be somewhere more upmarket, and they pay, then its your call again, so best to let them pay and maybe a nice present for their kids or something.
On queing, this is a northern european idea, and assumes everybody is in an equal hurry, though i have been to an english night club and mcdonalds afterwards and did not see any attempt at normal queing. I remember spanish friends lauhghing non stop when i told how a swiss friend braked to stop at a red light, rather than just drive through, it just is a different mindset.
I think thais are too polite to us and each other, allowing the few who are ill mannered to behave as they do.
My wife gets really annoyed by some thais behaviour but never says anything to them.
Off the tourist tracks people are more polite, i get the impression in hua hin some thais regard farangs as essentially a nusiance, but a necessary one, so they behave in a manner not normal in thailand.
As to unmannerly bar girls, well, really,
they should all go to finishing school after graduating like they do in europe
That covered a bit of ground.
On the subject of who pays the ferryman, I'd agree with you Packie.
I'll never forget being invited out for lunch by the owner of my old house. It was his brother who was in the chair. We ended up at a Japanese/Thai restaurant in Cha-am. Loads of good food and a bottle of JW Black Label.
I offered to buy a second bottle of JW, but they were having nothing to do with it.
So, I slipped out of the back door, went to the local 7-11 and bought a bottle. The Thais would not accept a drink from that until we got back to HH, sat in my ex's bar and then they happily helped me demolish it.
Face? I think so. They just didn't realise that I felt I was losing it by not reciprocating.
Culture clashes.
On the subject of who pays the ferryman, I'd agree with you Packie.
I'll never forget being invited out for lunch by the owner of my old house. It was his brother who was in the chair. We ended up at a Japanese/Thai restaurant in Cha-am. Loads of good food and a bottle of JW Black Label.
I offered to buy a second bottle of JW, but they were having nothing to do with it.
So, I slipped out of the back door, went to the local 7-11 and bought a bottle. The Thais would not accept a drink from that until we got back to HH, sat in my ex's bar and then they happily helped me demolish it.
Face? I think so. They just didn't realise that I felt I was losing it by not reciprocating.
Culture clashes.
I think that most people are good and you get treated as you treat (usually). One hot night I bought ice creams for the girls at Nat bar, the following day when we visited they had mango and sticky rice for me because they knew I liked it. We have always been treated well by the thai people we have met, maybe we have a lot to learn?
The jai's have it ...
Yet ANOTHER take on 'graeng jai' (or 'kraeng jai'):
But, that's OK (Thai mind thinking here) . . . because in the providing of "sanuk" to the greatest number ~ i.e. in the case above, setting up a street party for large numbers, late at night ~ the organizer(s) have demonstrated great amounts of "graeng jai" for their fellow Thai, soi dogs, and even possibly, passing farang.
The very thought that someone, somewhere, would possibly be awakened ~ and even more inexplicably ~ upset, by the noise created by the festivities is simply not in the picture. Why would it be? It's "sanuk" after all ... who doesn't enjoy having fun (in this world of suffering)?
If there is a grouchy/sleepy farang somewhere within earshot who cannot listen to the music and cannot hear the beat and cannot get up and get dressed and come outside and take part in the general "sanuk" (and, importantly, validating the organizer's "graeng jai") and, nearly as importantly, demonstrating your own joyful "sabai jai" . . . . if he can do none of those things then he is demonstrating "jai rawn" ~ your heart is hot, you get upset easily: " ... what's up with him? Oh well, nothing to do, cannot do anything, back to the fun ... "
Thais like to make 'sanuk' above all, and frankly, they don't really understand why anyone wouldn't want to as well. Including farang.
They will for sure understand you hopping out of bed, going outside, and enjoying the party. They will for sure not understand you sitting inside stewing and stressing about "sanuk" happening around you which you choose not to take part in. Or at the very least, being mildly bemused about the whole thing, and detouring around the hot heart and annoyance part of it all together.
Cheers ...
PS ... interesting topic and thread. Lots of differing takes on living within a another country and trying desperately to understand "mindsets" not your own.
When two kinds of "jai" meet up (like merging galaxys ... something's gotta give) ... in this case the Thai predilection towards acting "graeng jai" whenever possible, and the equally Thai desire to enjoy "sanuk" ('fun') whenever possible ("sanuk jai" ... I made that up, but think of it like that anyway) . . . "sanuk" will usually take the trump.Buksida wrote:" ... Another example is the street parties that Thais have, you know the ones where they block off an entire soi, all their mates park everywhere, they erect a two storey speaker systems and proceed to blast issan music at full bore way into the night without a sniff of consideration for the people living around them ... "
But, that's OK (Thai mind thinking here) . . . because in the providing of "sanuk" to the greatest number ~ i.e. in the case above, setting up a street party for large numbers, late at night ~ the organizer(s) have demonstrated great amounts of "graeng jai" for their fellow Thai, soi dogs, and even possibly, passing farang.
The very thought that someone, somewhere, would possibly be awakened ~ and even more inexplicably ~ upset, by the noise created by the festivities is simply not in the picture. Why would it be? It's "sanuk" after all ... who doesn't enjoy having fun (in this world of suffering)?
If there is a grouchy/sleepy farang somewhere within earshot who cannot listen to the music and cannot hear the beat and cannot get up and get dressed and come outside and take part in the general "sanuk" (and, importantly, validating the organizer's "graeng jai") and, nearly as importantly, demonstrating your own joyful "sabai jai" . . . . if he can do none of those things then he is demonstrating "jai rawn" ~ your heart is hot, you get upset easily: " ... what's up with him? Oh well, nothing to do, cannot do anything, back to the fun ... "
Thais like to make 'sanuk' above all, and frankly, they don't really understand why anyone wouldn't want to as well. Including farang.
They will for sure understand you hopping out of bed, going outside, and enjoying the party. They will for sure not understand you sitting inside stewing and stressing about "sanuk" happening around you which you choose not to take part in. Or at the very least, being mildly bemused about the whole thing, and detouring around the hot heart and annoyance part of it all together.
Cheers ...
PS ... interesting topic and thread. Lots of differing takes on living within a another country and trying desperately to understand "mindsets" not your own.
Just one more reason why I love living in Thailand ...
