Did you leave kids behind to come here?

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Lost
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Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:36 am

I begin this thread as it became worryingly apparent, after speaking with many expats, that there are a fair few who ditched kids in order to start a new life (or begin early retirement) here in the land of smiles.

Most of the people I know in this case left behind teenagers, usually to stay with their mum after a break-up, came here, settled with a Thai wife then had new kids of their own. I was raised to understand that a parents' duty (regardless of divorce) doesn't stop until the child has been put through education, has a means of making money and maybe a new family to start for themselves. I was fortunate my parents thought along these lines and allowed me to stay in the family home until I was 24 and ready to start a new life; financially, mentally and with a decent education to prop me up.

Is it selfish for a parent to leave teenage kids (or younger) without their mother/father around simply to benefit themselves... so they can start a new life abroad ? Or am I just old fashioned?

In my humble opinion, a child is still but a child until they reach 21/22. Early twenties, yeah, encourage their ass to be out of the house earning money on their own. But earlier? Nah. A child that age needs their parents around, together or not.

What are your thoughts?

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by handdrummer » Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:58 am

Depends on the child and their relationship with their parent(s). I was out the door at 18 and never went back. There's no one size fits all. At this point it's way too late if that was a good idea or not but I did well.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 2:44 am

handdrummer wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 1:58 am
Depends on the child and their relationship with their parent(s). I was out the door at 18 and never went back. There's no one size fits all. At this point it's way too late if that was a good idea or not but I did well.
Completely agree that some kids set off by themselves in those years. 15 or 16 even. But handrummer, were you forced to fend for yourself? Was it a sink or swim situation given by your parents? Did your parents then leave to another country?

Or did you decide to leave the family home yourself at 18 with parents still around? Big difference. Some kids aren't ready to leave at that age. Every kid should be given a choice if they want to be independent or not at that age. They also deserve their parents to be 'around' should things turn south.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by MDMK » Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:18 am

I think sometimes it’s better that a child has just one parent than two parents where one of them is shit at parenting.

I don’t disagree with a word you’ve said. When people decide to have kids then they should be making their kids a priority for the next two decades.

Sadly though that doesn’t always happen. People can be selfish. They can and do prioritize themselves above their offspring.

Better a father who fucks off to Thailand to start afresh than a disinterested waster of a father who lives around the corner. I do think some kids would be far better off rid completely of a bad parent. It must be soul-destroying to have the "so near and yet so far" type of father.

In our family we have more than 1 or 2 examples of utterly shit and self-centered parents. Male & female.

I wouldn’t even say your opinion is old fashioned. Because that would mean that the disinterested father (or for that matter mother, plenty of mothers abandon their kids too for pastures greener) is some kind of new phenomena, and it really isn’t. It’s just shit parenting and it’s been around as long as I have and no doubt (much much) longer.

A very sad subject in my opinion. I mean if you can’t be loyal to your own children, who can you be loyal to?

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by oakdale160 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:56 am

I left when my daughter was 24 finished UNI and working and my son was 21 in Uni and I supported him till he finished. At the time I felt very guilty and they both have been very hard on me for "deserting them"

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by oakdale160 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:58 am

I also wonder how a woman can marry and have children with a man who they know has abandoned his first family. Of course for many Thai ladies "The future" is next week.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:05 am

oakdale160 wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:56 am
I left when my daughter was 24 finished UNI and working and my son was 21 in Uni and I supported him till he finished. At the time I felt very guilty and they both have been very hard on me for "deserting them"
I think you were 'bang on' with what is an acceptable age to leave the kids and also in where they stood at the time... plus supporting the youngest to completion of his degree. Fair play - Exactly how it should be.

Early twenties (yes, they'll still kick up a fuss - simply because they still want you around) but anything in the teens or earlier IS 'deserting them' as you, IMO, haven't finished your responsibilities as a parent yet. Shouldn't of had 'em if you couldn't.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:08 am

oakdale160 wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:58 am
I also wonder how a woman can marry and have children with a man who they know has abandoned his first family. Of course for many Thai ladies "The future" is next week.
Not an issue. Only today is an issue. His past is no matter of hers. His money on the other hand...

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by HHTel » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:11 am

I was 16 when I joined the RN. By the time I was 19, I'd been around the world and was involved in the Indonesian-Malay confrontation. Based in Singapore, President Sukarno surrendered after he learned that I was involved in the fight.... lol. Saw a couple of mates killed. Got a medal. Grew up! Sometimes, getting out from under your parent's feet allows you to develop in ways that would have been impossible by staying in the nest.
I never got on with my father but after leaving, we became the best of friends.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:29 am

HHTel wrote:
Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:11 am
I was 16 when I joined the RN. By the time I was 19, I'd been around the world and was involved in the Indonesian-Malay confrontation. Based in Singapore, President Sukarno surrendered after he learned that I was involved in the fight.... lol. Saw a couple of mates killed. Got a medal. Grew up! Sometimes, getting out from under your parent's feet allows you to develop in ways that would have been impossible by staying in the nest.
I never got on with my father but after leaving, we became the best of friends.
Did your parents up sticks and leave to somewhere else giving you little option, though? I'm all for kids maturing quick. In our day we had to grow up fast. What I don't agree with is a parent(s) leaving to live at the other side of the world while the kids are still growing up.

HHTel, when you returned from your commendable battles, were your parents still there to welcome you home - or were they now in Australia (example)?

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by laphanphon » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:25 am

In a perfect world, 2 parents till their education is over, for some 18 yrs of age, other, 22 ish. Didn't have kids in the states, raise a few short time, in relationship, and can't imagine leaving them before educated. If mine, and lived together for a long time.

Raised one here, raising one now, in Uni, and can't imagine leaving here behind before she graduated high school, since raising here from 1 yr old. At Krung Thep now, so only see her during school breaks, or if we pop up to KT.

Still enjoys our company, so look forward to being together. Anything different, and could see not being in the same country, as reality, spend little time together now, a month or 2 at most, total time wise a year. A couple 2 week holidays would suffice if in different countries, and would only be possible because retired, and have the funds.

Others circumstance could be extremely different, whether relationship not so good, or finances.

As stated, one size doesn't fit, but I personally, couldn't be out of her life, till sure she can carry on by herself. If Uni or her life relationships doesn't, don't work out, I'd have no problem living next to her and supporting her, till I crap out.
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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:39 am

laphanphon said...
If Uni or her life relationships doesn't, don't work out, I'd have no problem living next to her and supporting her, till I crap out.
And this is what separates 'the wheat from the chaff' in the parenting world. Spot on laphanphon!

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by HHTel » Fri Aug 10, 2018 7:51 am

My folks were always there for me if needed even though miles (sometimes thousands) apart.
Okay, the other way round is really no different. It doesn't matter where in the world you are and how far your family is spread, you can still be there for each other. My daughter in the UK left for college when she was 16 and then on to university. I left a year before she graduated but returned to the UK for the occasion. Now she visits Thailand every year. In fact she took a sabbatical and spent a year here on an ED visa. My son was 18. He dropped out of school and was working. I made sure he had somewhere to live and had money to survive. As it happened, a couple of years later he came to visit and stayed for 12 years.
My two 'leuk krung' daughters, born in the UK came with us to Thailand. They have since moved on, the elder having gone back to the UK when she was 18 a couple of years ago and has been living in London ever since. We communicate regularly. One advantage of modern technology.
My mother, who is 93 comes to Thailand for 3 months every year.

I don't consider, leaving to start a new life as abandoning your children. No matter where you are in the world, you can still be there for them. I now have grandchildren in Thailand, mother, offspring and siblings in the UK but we're still a close family. I would always encourage kids to make their own life. 'Molly coddling' them can be detrimental to their development and make it much more difficult for them to leave their 'comfort zone'.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by Lost » Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:16 am

Good post HHTel but I've got to disagree with a couple of points
I don't consider, leaving to start a new life as abandoning your children. No matter where you are in the world, you can still be there for them.
The use of facetime, whatsapp, messenger, is absolutely no substitute to your children being able to come see you in person. You may disagree but I think the get out of, "doesn't matter where you are in the world, you can still be there for them" is grossly misplaced. Technology can't and won't replace actual physical contact with family.

You say you have 'leuk krung' daughters one of 18 who moved to the uk. Is her mother there or is she by herself? I'm hoping she at least has a network of close family around her in uk as 18 is too young for a young lady to start on her own with no family around in a different country.

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Re: Did you leave kids behind to come here?

Post by HHTel » Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:35 am

No, my daughter doesn't have her mother with her. Her UK family is dotted around the UK but none actually close by. She has made friends and runs a Thai restaurant in Putney. Everyone who knows her comments how mature and grown up she's become. She has been there 2 years now and is thoroughly enjoying life.
Physical contact is there but not on a continuous basis. I've found there is a great difference between youngsters who have 'flown the roost' to ones that haven't. My sister has four kids, 3 boys and a girl. 3 of them have their own lives, 2 with kids of their own and the eldest boy, who is now in his 30's still lives at home with his mother. I know which ones are more 'grown up'.
The use of facetime, whatsapp, messenger, is absolutely no substitute to your children being able to come see you in person.
They can and do come to see us in person. Each visit is more of an occasion than popping round for a cup of tea. I keep planning to visit in the UK but every time I mention it, I'm talked out of it as they would rather come here to see me than the other way round.

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