Why do many expats not bother to learn to read?

[nil]

Yes, the tones are really difficult to make out but they generally understand even if you get them wrong.

I don’t think that’s true at all. Thais are horrible at using context and logic to parse poorly pronounced Thai. As I said above:

If I ask for water and say นำ instead of น้ำ they look at me like I asked for a ticket to the moon.

My phone number ends with "9", which I usually mispronounce. So, if I say เกา instead of เก้า they just can’t figure it out. How many numbers are there that sound like เกา. Exactly one which only differs by tone.

Granted, in areas where there are plenty of farang speaking bad Thai, the locals have acquired some skill at understanding that bad Thai. But, elsewhere it’s a crap shoot that you usually lose.

I think it’s more important to try and pronounce the Thai consonant and vowel sounds correctly more than the tones. When Thai’s speak quickly they don’t pronounce every tone as there is not enough time. If you speak slowly it can be more confusing.

[Dannie Boy]

Yes, the tones are really difficult to make out but they generally understand even if you get them wrong.

I don’t think that’s true at all. Thais are horrible at using context and logic to parse poorly pronounced Thai. As I said above:

If I ask for water and say นำ instead of น้ำ they look at me like I asked for a ticket to the moon.

My phone number ends with "9", which I usually mispronounce. So, if I say เกา instead of เก้า they just can’t figure it out. How many numbers are there that sound like เกา. Exactly one which only differs by tone.

Granted, in areas where there are plenty of farang speaking bad Thai, the locals have acquired some skill at understanding that bad Thai. But, elsewhere it’s a crap shoot that you usually lose.

I think it’s more important to try and pronounce the Thai consonant and vowel sounds correctly more than the tones. When Thai’s speak quickly they don’t pronounce every tone as there is not enough time. If you speak slowly it can be more confusing.

The last couple of posts sum up why many expats don’t try to learn to speak the language - try as hard as they can and still have difficulty being understood!!


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[Ratsima]

The last couple of posts sum up why many expats don’t try to learn to speak the language - try as hard as they can and still have difficulty being understood!!

It’s been enormously frustrating for me. I have worked so hard and spent so much money and still it’s a bust. And, it’s not only being understood. This morning I saw the following quote from Mr Chuwit:

คบเด็กสร้างบ้าน คบพรรคเล็ก รัฐบาลพัง

I know what every word means, but had no idea what he was trying to say. How often does that happen. I know the words people have used but have no idea as to how to put them together to mean something.

[Scout]

If I ask for water and say นำ instead of น้ำ they look at me like I asked for a ticket to the moon.

That’s probably because the first one is a verb meaning ‘bring’ while the second one is a noun meaning water or liquid. If you just say นำ they are probably waiting for you to finish your sentence and wondering what you are going to ask them to bring. Try putting a verb (such as เอา or ขอ) in front of นำ or น้ำ and you’ll probably have better results. You could even say นำ น้ำ but you should then add a polite particle or they’ll think you’re a bossy snob

[Ratsima]

I would never ask for water by just saying นำ้. I’m always a complete sentence guy and I always use a polite particle at the end. And, if I walk into a shop I always say สวัสดีครับ to prepare them for the horrible pronunciation to come. It doesn’t seem to work.

I usually use something like ไม่ทราบว่ามีน้ำเปล่าครับ, which I learned by observing my wife.

[oakdale160]

I have a friend in BKK, his father worked supplying the US army during the VN war and he grew up in BKK. Thai people who have only spoken to him on the phone are staggered when they meet him to find he is American, his Thai is so good and apparently he can do local accents too. He tells me that for decades he rarely met foreigners in the business world who spoke good Thai but that is much more common now.

[Lost]

...Thai people who have only spoken to him on the phone are staggered when they meet him to find he is American, his Thai is so good and apparently he can do local accents too. He tells me that for decades he rarely met foreigners in the business world who spoke good Thai...

Erm...the man grew up in Bangkok, you say? Anything other than perfect Thai and the ability to do accents would be a sign of some sort of learning disability.

I grew up with a large Thai influence from the age of 10. If I couldn't speak somewhat fluently I would consider myself dumb. Fortunately I can and I don't. Could I learn a new language easily now? Not sure, never tried.

Growing up with a language (one different to your mother tongue) and learning a language are completely different. To learn a language requires good memory, patience and effort - none of these are required when growing up around the language... it just kinda happens naturally.

More foreigners are speaking fluent/perfect Thai now as more foreigners are spending their earlier years there.

[oakdale160]

Lost-- Neither my friend nor I are claiming that his Thai ability is in anyway special given the circumstances of his childhood, just remarking on his Thai speaking ability and his observations of Thai fluency of others in the business community.
I agree, children's abilities with languages is wonderful--Daddy speaks one language, mother another and the maid another--no problem, just speak to each in their own language.

[Jimbob]

I recently chatted with a young Thai who said he failed his final Exams in Thai but passed in English. Other young Thais have said similar. Easier to learn to read English than Thai. That heartened me to keep going with learning. Its not just me and its not easy. I struggle with Thai and the girlfriend struggles with English because of her education standard. I often marvel how small Thai script can be but people Thais still read it easily.
It really struggle having to learn so many derivative fonts: artistic but I often fail to see the original letter, especially as many look like Roman letters

[Ratsima]

just remarking on his Thai speaking ability and his observations of Thai fluency of others in the business community.

People in the business community have a lot of opportunity to practice Thai so they should be able to develop fluency. I don't have anyone with whom to speak Thai except the clerk at 7Eleven and the barista at the coffee shop. My wife is fluent in English and gave up on teaching me Thai at least a decade ago. So, I really have no opportunity to improve. You really need to be able to produce some Thai in order to understand it.

On the other hand, I have a neighbor who is fluent in Thai in spite of the fact that he's never taken a class nor opened a textbook. How? His wife didn't speak a word of anything but Thai so, for him, learning was a must and part of his every day life.