10-Day Detox Diary

[MrPlum]

Darwinian.

Why so hostile?

Thanks for that link. The headline is misleading. It appears to attack detoxification in general, when it's only certain OTC products that have little to do with real detoxification, as 'winkie' points out. I have warned about OTC (Over the counter) products previously.

If you have seen 'The Spa of Embarrassing Illnesses', you'll know they do not make unsupported health claims and are very open about what they are and aren't able to achieve. My own view is similar.

Whatever the pros and cons of any particular method, it's the results that count. In one of my latter posts I said 'the proof of the pudding is in the eating'. The married couple who went through the 10-day program both feel they have benefited from it. If you have a quicker more effective way to bring about positive change please share it with us.

I do agree that the word 'detox' needs to be defined more clearly. My own definition would be that a detox is akin to taking your car in for a major service and giving it a tune up. The spark plugs may have been coated or misfiring (digestion), the air (lungs) and oil filters (liver and kidneys) get a good workout and are thoroughly flushed and the fuel management system (nutrition) is fine tuned and optimized.

My car tends to run better after it's tuned. I do too.

This thread is not about selling useless supplements but about common sense, providing some useful tools and encouraging people to live healthier by focusing on the whole person... body, mind, emotions and spirit.

I don't trust claims by industry-sponsored 'scientists'. This guy is a little more to my liking...

"During fasting, the body burns up and excretes huge amounts of accumulated wastes. We can help this process by drinking alkaline juices instead of water. Juice fasting is therefore the very best form of fasting."
Dr. Ragnar Berg, Nobel Prize winner and the world's foremost authority on nutrition and biochemistry.

If you would like to learn a little more, I am running courses monthly. If you pm me, you are most welcome to come along and see for yourself and speak to the participants.

[Chas]

I agree. The article addresses detox PRODUCTS not the concept or any program that might be followed. The products they mention appear suspicious on the face of them.

Evelyn Harvey, a biologist who looked into the product, said that if consumers followed the healthy diet that was recommended alongside the supplement they would probably feel better -

"PROBABLY?" That's comforting. Dont go out on a limb there Evelyn! ( And I am going to take medical advice from a biologist?)

The thing is, IMHO there are aspects of Eastern, Chinese, Ayurvedic, Naturpathic treatments, massage therapies, Eastern religious practices, acupuncture etc. . . and even aspects of Western culture like fasting which might be useful to a person and which should be given a chance.

As a couple of posters have already noted, anything that helps a person to lead a healthier lifestyle is good.

Face it, Western doctors are trained to either cut or medicate everything and they have blinders on with regard to alternative ways and systems of treating ill health which might possibly be better.

I have never tried a detox or a fasting program, but I fully intend to do so and soon.

[MrPlum]

To further eliminate any confusion surrounding 'detoxes', it pays to differentiate between suspect over the counter get-rich-quick opportunism and the type of health and wellness taught by the ancients.

Ayurveda is a good example of how the ancients approached both internal and external 'cleansing'. Ayurveda is a 5000 year old healing system, presently gaining popularity in the West.

Ayurveda and Yoga were once part of the same 'Science of Life'. Yoga asanas (postures) prepare the body for meditation through strengthening and releasing, while the medical side of Ayurveda, removes maladies or dis-ease. Ayurveda is not just mumbo-jumbo but a comprehensive healing system. Modern surgery stemmed from great Ayurvedic surgeons, like Sushruta.

One important technique of Ayurveda is called Panchakarma.

'Panchakarma (five actions) is a cleansing and rejuvenating program for the body, mind and consciousness. It is known for its beneficial effects on overall health, wellness and self-healing.

Our Natural State

According to Ayurveda, our natural state is one of health, happiness and an inner sense of well-being. Health is defined as the body being clear of toxins, the mind is at peace, emotions are calm and happy, wastes are efficiently eliminated and organs are functioning normally. In a busy, stressful and toxic world, our physical and mental systems accumulate toxins causing deterioration in bodily functioning. This eventually weakens our systems, which opens the door for chronic, degenerative, and non-specific diseases to develop. These can evolve into serious specific diseases, ultimately damaging an individual’s health and wellness.

Panchakarma can help by reversing these negative effects of daily living. It can restore your natural state of health and wellness by cleansing your body of toxins, bringing balance into your system and improving bodily function. It can also help you sustain this process by making positive changes in lifestyle.

The Panchakarma therapeutic process appears quite simple in its application. However, its effects are powerful and effective. Panchakarma is a unique, natural, holistic, health-giving series of therapeutic treatments that cleanse the body’s deep tissues of toxins, open the subtle channels, bring life-enhancing energy thereby increasing vitality, inner peace, confidence and well-being.'

I have been to Kerala the home of Ayurveda and took a 70 year old man suffering from Cancer with me. I had developing arthritis and major stress. We had 6 weeks of intensive therapy, followed by two weeks 'Nature Cure' in the deep forests. I experienced some very strange (to westerners) therapies as part of Panchakarma, including enemas. No coffee enemas for me, It was herbs in raw milk. (more nourishing to 'Vatas'). I came away much improved, as did he.

That experience opened my eyes to the possibilities of natural cures and I have since studied and adopted some Ayurvedic and Yogic practices in my program using local herbs and fruits where possible. The key to success is properly identifying your unique constitution and seeing where imbalance lies. You then apply two simple principles.

1. Like increases like.
An example is if a hot tempered 'Pitta' type eats chillies and spends too long in the sun. He will become more irritable.

2. Opposites heal each other.
You can take that same 'Pitta' type and change his Pitta-increasing diet to a Pitta-reducing diet, by giving him foods with an 'opposite' cooling energy.

Thailand is famous for massage but did you know that when you have an Oil massage, Ayurveda recommends different oils for different types.

For Vata (Air) types , sesame oil is best to calm and balance the body
For Pitta (Fire) types, almond, olive and coconut oil are good
For Kapha (Earth) types, oils should be avoided altogether or only light oils applied.

While I'm happy to answer questions, it would help others who may wish to know about detoxing, not to have the thread ruined by unnecessary attacks or premature 'Gotcha!' moments . Answers to most queries are already contained within this topic. My intent was to educate and inform. Would be nice if we could keep it that way.

Cheers.

MrP

[Chas]

After reading all of the information on this thread and checking out a few things on the internet, I decided to take the plunge and sign up for a three day "detox" retreat with Mr. Plum.

I was not up to keeping an online diary of my retreat day by day or hour by hour, but I DO want to summarize my experience and heartily recommend it .

Just the fact that one spends time focusing on what one eats or doesnt eat . .or should eat is valuable in and of itself I feel. It is the sort of thing you cant really do at home with all the temptations of your everyday diet and a fully stocked refridge. You need to get away and take a careful look at what you eat and Mr. P proved to be an incredible resource. I have changed my diet for the better as a result of the "course" and I learned a lot about Ayurveda.

The second real accomplishment for me was beginning yoga. I have never had any experience with it whatsoever so this was a real education for me. Since the retreat a week or so ago, most days I have kept up with it too, although I dont remember every detail and every pose. (And of course it is harder to stay motivated on my own. ) Again, the focus is on being healthy and paying attention to one's body and this is something everyone can profit from IMHO.

I lost a couple pounds on the diet. I am not overweight to begin with, so I didnt expect to lose a lot but those couple of pounds made a nice and noticeable difference.

The diet with the lemonade drink and lots of flushes was OK. I didnt find myself hungry most of the time and there was no real craving there. The biggest problem was keeping busy during the times in between drinks and yoga/education sessions. Luckily I had brought along an excellent book that absorbed my attention every spare moment. ( It is called "Pillars of the Earth" by Ken Follet and it is absolutely WONDERFUL! You will not regret picking it up and you wont be able to put it down I guarantee.) OK OK. . . Back to the retreat:

To summarize, I found the whole experience refreshing. I found Mr. Plum to be incredibly well informed and experienced with all manner of related topics, herbs etc. He is very flexible and easy to get along with. . as you might guess from his posts here. I found his family warm and charming and his home very comfortable. I really enjoyed it!

I am considering the longer program sometime in the future and certainly will continue with the free yoga sessions Mr. Plum will arrange next month.

[darwinian]

I am hostile because "Detox" is a fraud.
Look at www.skepdic.com/detox

[Chas]

Darwin, I dont feel the least bit "defrauded" and I still dont get your hostility.

I spent a pleasant three days focused on my diet and my health, on living a better and more peaceful life. I came to understand my body better. I had my first lessons in yoga which I have always wanted to know more about and I learned about Ayuervedic practices which I found fascinating.

I am now eating healthier and feeling better as a result of what I learned on this retreat!

The entire experience was exactly what I wanted and actually turned out even better than I expected.

Where exactly is the fraud here?

[MrPlum]

I am hostile because "Detox" is a fraud.
Look at www.skepdic.com/detox

Hello again darwinian.

The issue of suspect detox 'products' has been dealt previously so I'll ignore that aspect in your link.

'Detox' is really just a matter of terminology. In natural medicine it's a non-specific term used to describe the elimination of anything that is suspected of causing sickness. Be it blood bacteria, bowel toxemia, skin eruptions, tar from tobacco, blocked sinuses, energetic pathways and so on.

Your own link actually recognizes detoxification. In the article it mentions the removal of heavy metals, using Chelation Therapy. This is classic DETOXING.

The article also states 'most of us probably do not think of alcohol, tobacco, heroin, or cocaine as poisons. Even so, such substances are toxic and therapies to eliminate them from usage are rightly called detoxification therapies.'

The article contains comments from the infamous 'Dr' Stephen Barrett. He runs the website 'Quackwatch'. He is not a medical doctor but a 'failed psychiatrist', paid by the medical/pharma industry to rubbish any and all natural therapies. IMO 'Quackwatch's aim is to deter people from trying natural or alternative methods to get well, under the guise of 'protecting' them. Whenever he's been in court he's either failed to turn up or been thrown out and ordered to stop harassing people. Usually after he's already destroyed any honest practitioner's reputation and finances.

'Sense in Science' should be called 'Nonsense in Science'. It's just another 'trust' amongst many who's purpose is to influence public policy towards orthodox goals using Al Gore-style bogus science.

Thankfully, there is a bottom-up movement (pardon the pun) by the public towards non-toxic, non-invasive methods of healing which won't go away, no matter what tactics the arrogant High Priests use. In Thailand, outside the cities, natural methods work alongside orthodox medicine. In India, Homeopathy and Ayurveda help tens of millions and are fully supported by the State.

Since fasting and cleaning the bowel have been used for thousands of years in most, if not all, countries of the world, there must be something in it, don't you think?

If you really wish to know about fraud read 'Racketeering in Medicine: The Suppression of Alternatives', 'Confessions of a Medical Heretic' or 'The Medical Mafia' by Dr. Guylaine Lanctot. There are plenty more in a similar vein.

[Chas]

Since fasting and cleaning the bowel have been used for thousands of years in most, if not all, countries of the world, there must be something in it don't you think

Mr. Plum, I was just going to add this bit to my post and you beat me to it.

I have also come to have a healthy distrust of MD's over the years. I have learned that there are "doctors" and then there are Doctors. Certificates and diplomas are no proof of ability or even common sense.

I remember back in the states having a run in with our highly respected family GP. I went in with a medical problem. . I knew exactly what it was and told him so with all the details. He thought he knew better and didnt listen. He prescribed all kinds of stuff that didnt work I suffered along until I finally went to a specialist who immediately confirmed that I had been right, gave me the correct medicine. Problem solved. I "fired" the GP and told him so in a letter. . he wrote back that I had an "attitude problem" or something like that. Never did apologize.

I have learned to check EVERYTHING on line, to look up EVERY prescription and especially to look up the side effects. I also question the doctor's decisions . . .all the time.