Terror plot to bomb planes foiled in the UK

[pinksquid]

I was almost sympathising until I read that. The comment reads like sheer petulance unless of course you can put my mind at rest and elaborate on what you meant by it.

Put your mind to rest about an opinion I have that you do not agree with? Seems like a fools errand to me, but since I am seen as selfish for wanting to comply with new regulations I might as well add "fool" to my definition too.

I have the opinion that has been cultivated through years of extensive travel and time spent in airports and on airplanes. I have close friends who work in the TSA and others who work for airlines.

My opinion is that breakables and valuables cannot be trusted to check-in baggage and the airlines agree-- most state such items should be carried on. I do not see at all how this opinion is in the least "sheer petulance".

Quite honestly, I do not even see why this is even an issue. I asked a question, if you have a problem with it PM me for clarification or ignore it.

And now, I think I will take my own advice and ignore this and you.

[Jaime]

It really is a shame that you feel the need to be so defensive. It is also a shame if you have been so badly irked by my comments that you feel the need to ignore me after just a couple of posts. However, I stated my opinion and asked for clarification because it was not clear at all to me that that is what you meant by your comment - i.e. that you did not trust the airport workers with your camera equipment.

I took it that you meant that the inconvenience of the security measures were somehow related to airport staff incompetence. Ridiculous I know, hence my reaction.

Maybe like your goodself I could have worded my post better? My apologies for being so thick and clumsy in this matter but you do now seem to be deriding me for doing exactly what you set out to do in your OP.

For the record I don't have a problem with you or your posts but unfortunately you seem to have taken my comments personally even after I have tried to clarify them here and in another part of the forum. I am not going to pm you but I hope that you will agree that perhaps we have both over reacted in this exchange - me initially and you subsequently. Here's to hoping.

[STEVE G]

The plot seems to have involved several passengers taking on different liquids, which could then be combined into an explosive, and detonated by a mobile phone battery using a smuggled detonator.
In light of this I think that within the next few days the international aviation authorities will bring out new guidelines which are likely to ban all liquids and all electrical devices from being carried on to aircraft, (with the obvious exceptions of medicines etc.).
The problem is that it is difficult to identify any particular constituent liquid, which would by itself, be innocent. Modern detonators are very small, about twice the size of a match head, and so very easy to conceal. After that, providing that you are a suicide bomber, you just need a battery.

[PeteC]

IMHO, I think it would be wondeful to be able to get from check-in to the gate in 5 minutes instead of 60, which is what would happen if carry on was banned, except for essentials like meds and baby formula as already stated.

Life expectancy of business people would rise by at least 5 years as they could relax on flights instead of working. Airlines could indeed incorporate keyboards and small memory units into their audio/video systems if the demand was there.

The garment industry would florish as everyone would be flying in cargo pants and shorts with adequate pockets instead of in coats and ties. I know it's necessary for a man to fly in coat and tie sometimes, but not SF to Tokyo. A fashion statement at 35,000 feet, and soooo uncomfortable.

There are hard shell, padded and compartmentalized, tamper proof lock cases available that can safely carry the most sensitive equipment, as baggage.

Women can wear their jewelry instead of stuffing their purses with it. There is nothing in a purse (either women's or men's) that can't go into a pocket, or left home if not essential, which most of it usually isn't.

So, perhaps with similar ideas and planning we cannot only help thwart in- flight terrorism but, help humanity relax and enjoy life more as well. Pete

[Bas]

The plot seems to have involved several passengers taking on different liquids, which could then be combined into an explosive, and detonated by a mobile phone battery using a smuggled detonator.

Confirming your info here: http://www.bangkokpost.net/breaking_new ... ?id=112141

[pasathai]

wonder how long b4 they find the next
"plot" is to put the bomb material inside their bodies, seems the drug smugglers have been doing this for years.

and the terrorists won't have to worry about being cought once they land.

Ever wonder how many ml. of butane it would take to blow out the side of a plane from inside the lavitory? banning lighters would not make much difference would it? ( at least it makes good press for tsa)

worrying about disposable cameras as an ignition source, while there are lots of florecent lights on aircraft.

[Big Boy]

As a start, I believe we should all be congratualting, no, celebrating the major success of the British and Pakistani security forces in preventing the mass murder of thousands of inocent passengers on this occassion. Long may their successes continue.

However, pasathai wrote:

Ever wonder how many ml. of butane it would take to blow out the side of a plane from inside the lavitory? banning lighters would not make much difference would it? ( at least it makes good press for tsa)

worrying about disposable cameras as an ignition source, while there are lots of florecent lights on aircraft.

I have to agree to a point that there are a lot of inconsistencies with what has happened, at least up until yesterday. I can quote a few examples of my own ie:

1. I used to carry a set of watchmakers screwdrivers in my briefcase for some of the fiddly work I need to do - nothing special, just £1 at the local market for a set. Over a period of 8 weeks, I had to fly Heathrow to Edinburgh every Sunday. Security never ever picked up the screwdrivers at Heathrow. Every week, on the return journey, the screwdrivers were always identified by security (and 'sometimes' confiscated at Edinburgh). I carried a similar set Heathrow to Glasgow over a longer period, and they were never ever picked up.

2. Last March I travelled to Thailand with a friend. He had a manicure set in his hand baggage - not picked up, even though Heathrow was on high alert at the time (trying something special out through Terminal 4). However, on the return journey, he had the manicure set confiscated at Bangkok.

3. 'Western' flights have had metal cutlery withdrawn. The same flights serve drinks from glass bottles. What would you find more threatening, somebody coming at you with an airline knife (that can hardly cut butter), or a broken bottle?

I could go on, as I'm sure a lot of you could. The point I'm trying to make is the security services should not become complacent, they should build on their success, and try to eliminate some more of their many weaknesses.

Maybe they should consider de-briefing a cross section of the travelling public on where they think security could be improved.

[Jockey]

Thank God these people were captured before the unimaginable horror they were going to create. I applaud the UK and Pakistani undercover police but I have to wonder when or if ever, this is going to stop. I have to ask myself why so many people want to take a war to the UK and America? I really don'ty think invading other countries, bombing and killing innocent people in the name of war against terror has any validity. It seems to me all Bush manages to do is spawn more terrorists than there were before. In my opinion, the best way to make airports more secure is to rid the world of Bush and his evil empire. Israel’s military assault on Lebanon continues to violate international humanitarian law as Israel pushes forward an agenda awash in unabated violent massacres and war crimes. US diplomacy has only complied with these war crimes through granting Israel impunity, thereby giving Israel the impression that it has permission to continue. America used to be a country the rest of the world looked to as an example of fairness, justice and good over evil. That all changed after the Kennedy assasination. Now America is run by weopan manufacturers and oil moguls. War makes money. Fear keeps them in power. They want the oil in the Middle East. They are evil and that's why we have 'terrorists' trying to fight back against them. If you had members of your family burned, raped, tortured, imprisoned without trial, may be you might decide to become a terrorist too. This current lot in power right now in the USA are a wicked lot in my opinion and the way they are going the whole world is heading for annhilation and WW3.

[caller]

Self edit - deleted.

Apologies to all, this was a post pub rant. Not wise.

Ist beer in a week!

I'm staying out of here.

[Norseman]

Jockey. Have you forgotten the plane hijackings by PFLP, Al Fatah and Yasser Arafat from the early 70's? Blowing up planes from Swissair, TWA and BOAC after forcing them down in the desert. Many more hijackings took place in those years and George Bush is still 30 years from beeing president.

I think you live in the UK. How would you like if at bunch of Scottish started firing salvos of Katucha rockets into England or sneak up on innocent gordies in order to kill and do as much damage in England as possible?

What would you have done after 911?
Let the terror continue and let the extremists take over?

How would you take out a bunker or a sniper hidden amongst civilians in the middle of a town?

The problem is not George Bush or Tony Blair, but the people who makes a mix-up of religion and statemanship and the governments who allow terrorists on their soil. Freedomfighters they call themself, but what kind of freedom do we want?

[STEVE G]

Norseman wrote;
I think you live in the UK. How would you like if at bunch of Scottish started firing salvos of Katucha rockets into England or sneak up on innocent gordies in order to kill and do as much damage in England as possible?

Hi, Norseman, don’t give them any ideas, I’m pretty sure Jockey is Scottish! From my experience they are quite keen on that sort of thing.

[Wanderlust]

Wow, Jockey really lit the blue touch paper didn't he?!! For what it's worth, I think they are ALL wrong, and none of them have right on their side, let alone an omnipotent being who let us have free will apparently. Greed and power are the things driving Bush and his cronies, not this media desire to see their form of democracy introduced everywhere else, while the 'terrorists' in general would seem to be religious zealots who have been brainwashed into killing themselves and others for their 'God', except for the few at the top pulling the strings who have the same agenda as Bush. The Israelis have never acted as a developed country should, because their religion calls for 'an eye for an eye'; the only problem there is they are taking far more than an eye for an eye - would they think twice about using their nuclear weapons if they felt it was necessary? I think not. And if Iran has that capability (or far worse, Al Quaeda or Hezbollah) then they wouldn't hesitate either. None of these players have any concern for their citizens, including the USA, and unfortunately it seems that that government attitude has extended worldwide now, including the place we love, Thailand. Time for the world citizens to take all our money out of the banks and stop paying tax en masse as a protest methinks? Or for China to flex it's muscles when it's security becomes threatened? I shudder to think...

[Jockey]

Norseman wrote;
I think you live in the UK. How would you like if at bunch of Scottish started firing salvos of Katucha rockets into England or sneak up on innocent gordies in order to kill and do as much damage in England as possible?

Hi, Norseman, don’t give them any ideas, I’m pretty sure Jockey is Scottish! From my experience they are quite keen on that sort of thing.

You beat me to it Steve (We wouldn't need to sneak up on Geordies - they would be on our side)

Caller - If you look at my post it was done at 4:30am Friday / Sat morning so similar excuses to your own. I stand by what I said, but I admit also the words were fuelled with that stuff they make in Scotland and are a bit over dramatic for the Hua Hin afterdark message board! (Jockstrap!!!!????? )

[STEVE G]

Caller wrote;
Self edit - deleted.
Apologies to all, this was a post pub rant. Not wise.


Hi Caller, you could have left it up long enough for us to have a read, I’ll have to start getting up earlier.


Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut. –Ernest Hemingway (1899-1961)

[Norseman]

I've asked this question before but I still find it valid:
Why is Europe a restricted area for the buddhist Thai-ladies, but wide open for extremist militants?
Both the US and Europe needs more nice people! (and better looking).