How does one research a builder/developer here

[migrant]

I work with quite a few contractors and here in the States it works similar to what SJ suggests.

The banks that do the financing make the contractors submit details of the work done then send them a percentage of the money. Often the banks will send inspectors that verify what was done.

Saying that some banks who were lax in this housing crises and didn't do their inspections got burned by some builders

[Whaler]

Can anyone tell me what's so difficult about this, we negotiate harder than this SJ

SJ this is exactly what I have done with Hot Properties. I even structured the payments to suit my moving in date and I have 100's of photos that are sent almost on a weekly basis. In addition I also have clauses of final site development, roads, services etc. Even Jane (the UK solicitor in HH) remarked on the additional conditions Hot Properties included and accepted compared to many others. Included in the contract are a full set of 30+ drawings and pricing plans for internal fittings etc and references to build quality.

I think some get duped in to putting more upfront for several reasons

Some lose sight simply as the relative cost in HH compared to UK/Europe, if you are a cash buyer on the low end of the market it's not much more than many pay for a static caravan in UK and you seldom have a contract or solicitor involved.

Some builders may try several tricks, like you get a discount, or materials are increasing or this and that will be finished sooner etc or someone else wants this plot

Simple greed and or excitement gets the better of some and going over your budget to get a bigger property resulting in efforts to save cost can increase your exposure.

I have dealt with staged bank payments on properties before and they are no guarantee. I doubt very much that a HH bank would be sending around a professional surveyor who knows the difference of blocks or rendering.

The worse scenarios I have seen was the selling off plan in Dubai where shear greed and the belief it must be safe as others have done it meant many properties sold more than 5 times before they were even built.

Many contracts and staged payments did not stop when the building did. If you stopped paying you defaulted on the contract which had ridiculous forfeits. Many now still do not have much more than a hole in the ground the lucky ones are just missing pools, gyms, car parking.

The annual service charges quadrupled; there are no community slush fund for 10 year maintenance and replacement of lifts etc. You’re tied in to ridiculous tv services and HVAC/electricity payments the list goes on.............

Yet many bought on a two page contract that was completely biased for the developer.

Sometimes you just can't help folks

[hhfarang]

I even structured the payments to suit my moving in date and I have 100's of photos that are sent almost on a weekly basis. In addition I also have clauses of final site development, roads, services etc. Even Jane (the UK solicitor in HH) remarked on the additional conditions Hot Properties included and accepted compared to many others. Included in the contract are a full set of 30+ drawings and pricing plans for internal fittings etc and references to build quality.

Whaler, please keep us informed on how your build goes as it progresses and you come here to view first hand. Even with all the safeguards you have in place there are no guarantees as most contracts here are not worth the paper they are printed on, unless you have years of your life to waste in Thai courts and deep pockets to pay legal fees and travel expenses in the meantime. Unless you have more time to spend here than your developer and more money to spend on legal fees and under the table payments, you are likely to get no satisfaction if your build or community goes pear shaped.

I've known few absentee buyers who were happy with what they got in the end, even with lawyers, contracts, and a property management company sending them photos.

Best of luck with yours.

[Whaler]

Whaler, please keep us informed on how your build goes as it progresses and you come here to view first hand. Best of luck with yours.

hhfarang
Thanks, I don't want to sound like an ad for HP or not follow my own comment on biased reviews

However I relate our own experience:
We are already long term expats working outside UK so are well accustomed and acclimatised to overseas living. We have looked in many countries during our holidays to purchase and even during the last 3 years we found little or no bargains as simple most people cannot afford to sell off their homes cheaply, particularly in Spain a favourite for UK buyers.

Any country that does not have a low salary indigenous workforce is expensive to retire too or maintain a holiday property. Leasing land has never been an issue with us simple as we are not pouring our life savings in to an overseas property (i.e. if things go belly up you should be able to survive).

We like it hot and sunny, we don’t want a winter. Island life sounds idyllic but soon as you can't have or go somewhere you want it, having the opportunity or access is important even if you never do it. Richness of culture is a must and it's the little odd things that keep you alive even if it's just to moan about it

We came to HH on a whim of a suggestion by a friend. We stayed for 3 weeks last summer and I’m not sure if our experience or gut instinct let us quickly evaluate the uniqueness of what in HH for expats. I know some of the long termers complain but HH still does not have extremes in any one direction compared to many places.

We did our usual brief research via the net and contacted many property companies before travelling. Very few actually give a good response; HP was one of these exceptions. Having some idea on how far your money will go simplified what to view. We only spent a few cloudy days running around the new builds in our price range and radius of 10-15k max of town. Condos or resort type properties simply were not on our shopping list. We did feel a view, land or sea was a priority simply based on patio drinking habits.

We found using a property company like HP simplified things and over the days we found no reason not to trust their judgments on viewings at no time did it contradict our research. They were willing to show us properties we had selected that were not necessarily on their books and any adhoc stops or visits along the way. Did we do enough research, probably not, would of seeing more changed our mind, probably as we may of seen something exceptional but way over budget, it’s just too easy to get carried away.

HP not only recommends using a solicitor, they take you there. It was evident talking to Jane (UK solicitor) that there are differences with Thai law and nothing is bullet proof all you can do is hope you have the best available giving the conditions that prevail.

Being already spoilt expats HP made life very simple for us and their willingness to agree to our terms and conditions drafted by Jane enhanced our confidence. We also extended the build/payment schedule to 12 months from the usual 6-8 as it gave a better spread of risk and development.

The house is now well on its way and maybe 2 months ahead of month 4 of the schedule and is just entering the rendering/plastering stage with all the roof and walls up, even the pool is substantially finished including tiling. The site development power/roads/ satellite/internet feed/ town and independent well are 6 months ahead of expectations. This was my biggest concern living on a building site waiting for the other plots to finish. But with sub divisions of 8 plots and being ahead it is not a problem anymore.

We came out in Feb for an inspection and to pick appliances and tiles etc. Part of the build is a furniture package tie-in (if you want it) with Karen at Beautiful world. We met her and selected everything in a matter of an hour she also arranged meeting with a local curtain supplier who we have since changed to a cheaper one on Karen’s recommendation.

It’s simply been the most stress free significant purchase we have ever made. The repore with John and Anthony at HP is outstanding we can trust them to interpret my requests for changes and finishing’s. They even arranged for SJ to look at fitting my alarms system. Karen at Beautiful world takes care of everything furnishing wise. Crazzy88 unknowingly is sorting out our bar crawl itinerary up Soi88 . All the shop assistants at the major retails were very helpful, photocopying spec pages and whipping out tape measures etc.

Its been so enjoyable I wish I was buying another. Maybe I could have done it for 500K cheaper or more if you got the land separately and went for full custom build, if you rented/lived in HH during the process. But for peace of mind and stress free when doing this 4K miles away its money well spent. I have no reason to doubt that in August the house will be fully habitable, just add plates and wine, maybe Johnnie will even supply the wine .

[hhfarang]

Sounds like you've covered all the bases! Good on you!

[dubchick]

Thanks for posting this thread. Originally when we had planned our next Hua Hin trip it was going to involve seriously looking around at condos/villas to see whether buying one as a holiday rental investment was possible. We noticed last year when we were there that there was quite a few developer stands in the shopping mall, and its very hard to figure out who's legit. Especially considering we wouldn't be there to watch the progress of the building etc.

I don't think it's going to happen on our next trip now, but somewhere in the future we'd really like to look into it.

[cookmanchef]

A lot of good sound advice here, I bought and sold here previously with no problems. I've been looking around the Dolphin bay area and really think anyone considering coming to live in Thailand should consider buying there. Beautiful beaches and increasing numbers of good restaurants/ bars/shops, good roads and, seemingly a plan for the future.

[thaifan]

I too am grateful for this thread. Lots of good info here. I'm seriously considering buying a holiday house in Khao Tao, so insights and experiences of people like Whaler are invaluable.

Can somebody please share the full name/contact of Jane, the UK solicitor? There are many favorable mentions of her services throughout this forum, I'd like to contact her but don't see her name on the company website.

Thanks.

[pitsch]

A lot of good sound advice here, I bought and sold here previously with no problems. I've been looking around the Dolphin bay area and really think anyone considering coming to live in Thailand should consider buying there. Beautiful beaches and increasing numbers of good restaurants/ bars/shops, good roads and, seemingly a plan for the future.

I live near Dolphin Bay and agree to the beaches and restaurants. Bars are mostly hotel bars, shops are not existent, you have to go to Pranburi. Where do you see a plan for the future?? There is a lot of construction going on at the moment, but I don't have the impression that there is any coordination.

Now it is a rather quiet spot, but I think in some years there will be a lot more tourists there.

[JW]

Have pmd u Jane's detail, get 4 more posts!

[thaifan]

Thanks JW :-)

[Whaler]

thaifan

You will like Jane, it's all very simple she does what it says on the box, so to speak

A one off price no hidden extras, she supplies a spec sheet and answers all your questions before you engage her services which is a simple one off upfront payment.

Just a quick update on my build:

Getting down now to the nitty gritty of interior and finishing so not the major advances you see during the construction period.

However I was suppplied with a complete set of 3D rendered CAD drawings of all the bedroom and kitchen layouts showing the cupboards and units both with the doors opened and closed. Just annotate your comments and send them back, could not be easier and no ambiguity. Detailing around the infiniti pool continous all exterior rendereing completed and power sockets marked out.

Awaiting well water report so we can specify filters to the 2x2000L tanks to minimise any water shortages. The site continues with roads well on to finishing including plant borders etc, massive waste water ground tank for the site almost completed. Second phase boundry walls constructed. Surprisingly HP continue to add no cost extras like buying land and widening the access roads and re-surfacing them even though they are technically goverment roads.

[johnnymac]

Great to hear some good news about property development in HH after all the bad last year.

Thanks to all for the feedback and advice.

[Whaler]

BTW should anyone wish to view the build sequance of my property drop me a PM and will send link to the on-line album of 200+ pics, although washing your hair could be slightly more intresting

[cookmanchef]

Hi Pitsch, Dolphin Bay Developers Association is currently being set up to try to co-ordinate the growth of the bay area. The hope is to prevent a lot of the mistakes that have been made elsewhere, and as the area grows, do everything possible to maintain the charm of the area, (not cutting down trees etc.) Another aim of DBDA is to try to include the local residents and make sure they benefit from any future development, Barefoot and Beach Village are at the forefront of these plans, Barefoot in particular is perfect for the area with its traditional teak villas.