Vaccines - Covid 19

[GroveHillWanderer]

This virus and it's variants are not going to end. Eventually, there may be a vaccine that will control the outbreaks but it will be many years before that happens.

Nobody knows what's going to happen with this virus and the variants. It may be as you say but it may not. Some virologists believe that the virus will eventually mutate into a form that is less deadly and/or immunity will become more widespread, such that it ends up being more like a seasonal flu (which it definitely is not at the moment) or may even become as mild as the other coronaviruses that cause no more than the symptoms of a common cold.

As for it being many years before there will be a vaccine to control this virus - I'm pretty sure we already have those. Unless and until a new variant comes along, the current vaccines (at least the better ones) are still very effective against all the variants we have at the present time.

Here's just one example from the Financial Times, about the Pfizer vaccine in relation to the Delta variant:

Canadian scientists on Saturday, using a combination of methods, estimated that the Pfizer jab was 87 per cent effective at preventing infection with the Delta variant.

https://www.ft.com/content/5a24d39a-a70 ... 2a524dc9a5

Similar efficacy had been found for the Moderna and AstraZeneca vaccines, especially for the Alpha and Delta variants.

The variant that seems to do the best at evading the vaccines is the Beta variant originally discovered in South Africa but fortunately for everyone, it seems to be much less transmissible than the others mentioned and is not spreading very widely (so far, at least).

[HHTel]

This virus and it's variants are not going to end. Eventually, there may be a vaccine that will control the outbreaks but it will be many years before that happens.

You may as well get on with your lives as best you can and not cower in the corner waiting for a miracle. Miracles may happen but don't count on them.

Well after many years they've not managed to do it for the 'flu so I guess that will never happen. The 'flu virus mutates every year. The 'flu shot is modified twice a year to cope with the latest mutations. However, the shot has to be developed in advance so much of the 'update' to the 'flu shot is guesswork. Sometimes they get a good match (good guess!) and sometimes they don't. I read that in 2020 they came up with a bad match but covid restrictions helped against the spread of 'flu.

I guess that the covid vaccine will fall into a similar category.

[PeteC]

Send in the clowns, they are already here! One woman at WHO said today "Well, maybe mixing jabs could be dangerous..." and with that this country puts the brakes on everything. You can't make this stuff up. Haven't other countries already been giving boosters with a different vaccine?

Vaccine policy switch leaves health services confused

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/ge ... s-confused

Hospitals and health offices have been left confused over the mixing of doses of Sinovac and AstraZeneca vaccines after the prime minister questioned the Health Ministry's latest policy to curb the spread of Covid-19.

The provincial health office in Nonthaburi on Wednesday opted to postpone its plan to give people who have received a single dose of the Sinovac vaccine a dose of AstraZeneca as their second jab.

Some private and public hospitals in Chiang Mai, including Hang Dong Hospital, announced they would provide no vaccination service on Wednesday.

Nonthaburi was the first province to adopt the ministry's new policy after it was endorsed by the National Communicable Disease Committee on Monday. The panel was chaired by Public Health Minister Anutin Charnvirakul.

Nonthaburi announced its decision on Tuesday, only to immediately suspend its implementation on Wednesday morning.

In Chiang Mai, the provincial public health office also announced its suspension. "In order to end the confusion, all health units are ordered to stop vaccine service on July 14, 2021," Hang Dong Hospital posted the message on its Facebook account.

Mr Anutin said after the committee meeting on Monday that mixing the Sinovac for the first dose with AstraZeneca for the second would yield a better defence against the highly transmissible Delta variant of the coronavirus first detected in India.

However, Prime Minister Prayut called for a thorough study of the jab policy shift during Tuesday's teleconferenced cabinet meeting, to take into consideration the safety of vaccine recipients.

The prime minister's reaction followed a warning from the World Health Organization on Monday that indviduals should not mix and match different vaccines.

"Individuals should not decide for themselves, public health agencies can, based on available data. Data from mix and match studies of different vaccines are awaited -- immunogenicity and safety both need to be evaluated," WHO chief scientist Soumya Swaminathan said.

Respected virus expert Yong Poovorawan on Tuesday was adamant using Sinovac and AstraZeneca vaccines in series was safe and effective and Thailand's best option for fighting the fast-spreading Delta variant.

Government spokesman Anucha Burapachaisri on Wednesday explained that the prime minister did not order the plan cancelled, but he hoped the committee to be open for more reactions first.

The government's priority was to see more people inoculated, as that would reduce the rate of daily fatalities and new infections, he said.

[HHTel]

There are several reports, including one from the UK, that state that results so far have shown an increase in efficacy and therefore a stronger immunity. Germany and Spain are already using a mix of Pfizer and Moderna. Vietnam, who have never used Sinovac, are ready to boost the AZ vaccinations with Pfizer.

I think the WHO is being extra cautious and would like to see a study based on much larger numbers and a much longer period. Sometimes, you have to 'bite the bullet'.

[hhinner]

Just as long as the 2nd and 3rd jabs are not Sinovac. Just my opinion based on nothing much other than many reports of how Sinovac isn't much good. And a report I saw on Sky News from Indonesia this morning.

[GroveHillWanderer]

Well after many years they've not managed to do it for the 'flu so I guess that will never happen. The 'flu virus mutates every year. The 'flu shot is modified twice a year to cope with the latest mutations. However, the shot has to be developed in advance so much of the 'update' to the 'flu shot is guesswork. Sometimes they get a good match (good guess!) and sometimes they don't. I read that in 2020 they came up with a bad match but covid restrictions helped against the spread of 'flu.

I guess that the covid vaccine will fall into a similar category.

I don't think you can really compare the influenza viruses with the SARS-CoV-2 virus. For a start there isn't just one influenza virus strain - there are dozens, divided into four sub-families - A, B, C & D (though only A & B are of concern to humans). Each different strain requires a separate vaccine which is why the flu shots you get are not a single vaccine, they're either a trivalent or quadrivalent vaccine - meaning they actually have either 3 or 4 different vaccines combined into one shot. These combinations are subject to change each year, depending on which 3 or 4 of the many different strains are expected to be the most prevalent.

This is because the flu viruses are much more highly mutagenic than the coronavirus and are subject to both antigenic drift and antigenic shift.

As stated in the article below:

Antigenic drift refers to the accumulation of genetic mutations that cause an alteration in the surface of the virus (the mutated antigen ‘drifts’ from the original conformation). This is one of the main reasons why a novel flu vaccine is required every year. Antigenic shift occurs when segments from the genome of two different viruses combine to make a novel strain. Coronaviruses are not prone to undergo antigenic drift or shift.

https://www.astrazeneca.com/what-scienc ... cov-2.html

SARS-CoV-2 on the other hand, after a year and a half is still (despite variants) a single virus and since it doesn't undergo either antigenic drift or shift, it means the changes are relatively minor and don't immediately necessitate a wholly new vaccine. While it's true that some companies are working on variant-specific versions of their vaccines, it's still not clear whether these will actually be needed.

So we can't really say that coronavirus vaccines will end up being like flu vaccines that have to change on a yearly basis, because coronaviruses are fundamentally different to influenza viruses in the way they mutate.

[PeteC]

You continuously post clear and concise information on this subject, GHW. Thanks for that.

[joelle]

You continuously post clear and concise information on this subject, GHW. Thanks for that.

Yes i second this

[PeteC]

php2BSYouAM.jpg (125.37 KiB) Viewed 974 times

Thailand's Vaccine Tracker (July 14, 2021)
.
About 5.05% of the population is fully vaccinated. 9,888,124 (+289,175) people have received the first dose, while 3,342,557 (+33,313) have been fully inoculated. At this rate, Thailand needs to administer 554,997 doses per day within 172 days to reach the herd immunity target by the year's end.

[Dannie Boy]

php2BSYouAM.jpg


Thailand's Vaccine Tracker (July 14, 2021)
.
About 5.05% of the population is fully vaccinated. 9,888,124 (+289,175) people have received the first dose, while 3,342,557 (+33,313) have been fully inoculated. At this rate, Thailand needs to administer 554,997 doses per day within 172 days to reach the herd immunity target by the year's end.

Which we all know is extremely unlikely, if not impossible to achieve!!

[PeteC]

^ Of course impossible, but Khaosod will continue to stick it in their face for the next 172 days.

[hhinner]

^ Of course impossible, but Khaosod will continue to stick it in their face for the next 172 days.

Good for Khaosod. Someone needs to keep showing constant updates on what this government says and does.

Anyone keeping track on bringing happiness back?

[HHTel]

From GHW:

So we can't really say that coronavirus vaccines will end up being like flu vaccines that have to change on a yearly basis, because coronaviruses are fundamentally different to influenza viruses in the way they mutate.

I'd actually read various reports similar to the ones you quote. I was trying to summarise/speculate.

While more is learned every day about COVID-19 and the virus that causes it, there are still things, such as post-COVID conditions, that are unknown. This page compares COVID-19 and flu, given the best available information to date.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/symptoms/flu-vs-covid19.htm

Chances are the COVID-19 vaccine most people will be receiving this year, will not be their last. But whether or not the COVID-19 vaccine will need to be administered to people yearly, is simply not known at this point.

The vaccine simply hasn’t existed long enough to determine how long immunity lasts, and we also haven’t had the virus itself around long enough to determine whether or not there are going to be different strains that circulate each year similar to influenza,” Tom Hudachko, Director of Communications at the Utah Department of Health, says.

That’s why the flu shot changes each year, he says. The flu has been around long enough to have created different strains, and therefore, the vaccine has to be tweaked each year to keep up with them.

“Over time, what the virus will need to do to survive is infect people that have been vaccinated. If variants occur naturally where the virus is more able to infect people who’ve been vaccinated, then we’ll start to see those variants spread more easily,” he says.

That’s what happens with the flu, and that’s why flu shots are different year to year. They adapt to keep up with new strains. However, the nature of the flu makes it far more likely to create new strains than COVID-19.

“So flu is uniquely adapted for rapid change. Coronavirus not so much, but like all viruses over time, it will change,” Dr. Pavia states.

He says it is likely that over time the virus is going to start to change in ways that make it more resistant to the current vaccine.

“Then we’re going to have to tweak the vaccine just like we do with the flu vaccine, but probably not every year,” he says.

https://www.abc4.com/coronavirus/will-i ... -flu-shot/

[buksida]

AstraZeneca seeks to extend delivery timeline for 61m vaccine doses
AstraZeneca has asked to extend the timeline for the delivery of 61 million doses of its Covid-19 vaccine to Thailand from December to May 2022, Deputy Health Minister Sathit Pitutacha said on Thursday, a move likely to disrupt further the country's sluggish vaccine rollout.

Deputy Health Minister Sathit Pitutacha said AstraZeneca currently had the capacity to produce 15 million doses of vaccine per month at its production facility in Nonthaburi and that capacity could expand in the future.

The company has promised to deliver 40% of what is produced there inside the country, the deputy health minister said, adding that the government will ask the company for more doses.

"We must negotiate with them because in this situation we need more vaccine," Mr Sathit said.

"We want 10 million doses because the original plan was 10 million doses," he said referring to the previous monthly delivery target.

A day earlier, the government said it was considering imposing limits on exports of locally manufactured AstraZeneca Covid-19 vaccine to fight its own outbreak.

https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/ge ... cine-doses

May 2022 ...

[StevePIraq]

An update from Hua Hin Hospital as of 13.15hr 15/7/21. They have no vaccines available and do not have a date when the next batch will be delivered for vaccinations to resume.

So its just wait and see and keep contacting them, plus you can check the FB page for updates.