History Challenge & Journal

[sandman67]

Ok, I thought Stevie G would swoop in with the answer.

All three have been cited as the cause of someone laughing themselves to death

The Goodies episode Kung-Fu Kapers contained the scene above, where Bill Oddie, master of the ancient Lancastrian martial art Ecky-Thump, takes on all challengers. That scene started 50-year-old Alex Mitchell off on a 25 minute laughing bout that ended with him collapsing with a heart attack and dying. His widow later sent The Goodies a letter thanking them for making his last minutes on Earth so filled with laughter.
In 1989 a Danish bloke called Ole Bentzen went into a laughing fit at the scene in A Fish Called Wanda where Kevin Kline tortures fish lover Michael Palin by eating his fish one by one. Ole collapsed and died of a heart attack still laughing his head off.
And King Charles II? Well, on hearing that the English had restored the monarchy and put Charles II on the throne famous Scots wit, polymath and writer Sir Thomas Urquhart is said to have laughed himself to death, although the exact reason he found it so funny died with him.

[pdm3547]

<too late>

[dtaai-maai]

Okay, this isn't a quiz question so much as a topic for discussion. Please don't use Google or other Internet sources at this point, as the whole thing would become just a regurgitation of website info.

When does a town become a city? i.e. What qualifies a city as a city? Who decides? Is it official or legally binding? Does it make any practical difference?

Different categories, as the answers are almost certainly different in different parts of the world.

In the UK and western Europe.

In North America.

Anywhere else you like.

[PeteC]

I don't have a clue but to start it off, I would think that in all places it has to do 1) with population, 2) with geographic size.

I'm sure Capetown, as a quick example, indeed started as a town but got to the size in both people and area that it's designation changed.

Who decides when this transformation happens and what the exact rules are....I'll punt. Pete

[Nereus]

Anywhere else you like.

In the Western Australian state that I grew up in it is a very complex subject. There is no one answer that applies to all the different places. A country town can apply to the state government when the population of the town reaches 20,000 people, and a certain % must live in the urban area.

There are areas of local government (councils) within major cities, such as the capital Perth, where different critera apply, such as the population must be 35,000. There is a move afoot to combine many of them into one council to try and reduce duplication of costs.

And then the PC brigade stick their nose in, and it all goes tits up!

[dtaai-maai]

I'm not sure what got me onto this topic, but I have a little time on my hands for once and was browsing this a.m.

My understanding in the UK is that, traditionally, in order to qualify as a city, a town had to have a cathedral, hence somewhere like Ely, with a small population, would still be a city. I don't know when this 'requirement' ended, but it obviously (presumably?) doesn't apply today.

[Jimbob]

My understanding is that in Europe when a town got a bishop his church became a catherdral and the town could call itself a city.
Only cities have Lord Mayors. We have the city of London with a lord Mayor and the city of Westminster with no Lord mayor all covered by the city of Greater London? Hmm.
did it have something to do originally with royal decrees issued to allow city incorporation and raise taxes?
Noice question DM

[dtaai-maai]

My game, my rules, and I'm breaking them. Complain to a Mod.

did it have something to do originally with royal decrees issued to allow city incorporation and raise taxes?

Some interesting snippets about Ely (both of them).

Ely has been called a city for a long time because it has a cathedral. However, the Royal Charter making it a city was only issued in 1974. Ely's population was 15,102 in 2001. This means Ely is the third smallest city in England. Only Wells in Somerset and the City of London are smaller.

Ely is the largest city and county seat of White Pine County, Nevada, United States. Ely was founded as a stagecoach station along the Pony Express and Central Overland Route. Ely's mining boom came later than the other towns along US 50, with the discovery of copper in 1906. Though the railroads connecting the First Transcontinental Railroad to the mines in Austin and Eureka have long been removed, the railroad to Ely is preserved as a heritage railway by the Nevada Northern Railway and known as the Ghost Train of Old Ely.[1][2] As of the 2010 census, the population was 4,255.

Population 4,000 - a city? How does that work? I doubt it would even qualify as a town in the UK! (Ooo, there's another question - when does a village become a town?)

[pdm3547]

Okay, this isn't a quiz question so much as a topic for discussion. Please don't use Google or other Internet sources at this point, as the whole thing would become just a regurgitation of website info.

When does a town become a city? i.e. What qualifies a city as a city? Who decides? Is it official or legally binding? Does it make any practical difference?

Different categories, as the answers are almost certainly different in different parts of the world.

In the UK and western Europe.

In North America.

Anywhere else you like.

I used to live in a cathedral town in North Wales called St Asaph. It was most definitely a town, it has the smallest cathedral in the world at the top of the high street, and it's own archbishop (the second highest clergyman in Wales, third in the UK). Despite all this, it remains a town.

It goes back to the 1600s, and the failure of the elders to pay their city dues to the monarch at the time. All towns were eligible to be called cities on payment of these dues.

There have been a number of campaigns to have St Asaph elevated to city status, the last (I think) was around the time of the Queen's golden jubilee. We lost out to Milton Keynes!

(Edit: I'm obviously a bit behind the times. St Asaph is now a city! Yay! http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Asaph)

[dtaai-maai]

Interesting, especially as I was recently reading a novel set in the 12th century based in that area and regularly featuring what was then St. Asaph's abbey.

I'm obviously a bit behind the times. St Asaph is now a city! Yay!

My faith in human nature is restored!

[dtaai-maai]

(Ooo, there's another question - when does a village become a town?)

There's a lot more to this village v. town lark than I'd imagined.

A borough council “secretly” reclassified a village as a town in order to build hundreds more homes in the area.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/greenp ... homes.html

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre ... into-towns

But to turn a village into the sort of thriving economic powerhouse envisaged by TRC would require building not only the housing but also the premises where the economic activity would take place. In essence, turning a village into a town.

Why? Why turn a village into a town, when it's already doing a grand job as a village? Why force villages to accept "social housing" if there's no indigenous employment? Underlying this is an unchallenged assumption that there's a "right" to live in a village. If so, then there must surely be a concomitant right to live in Knightsbridge.

The vague desire to "live in the country" isn't a defensible basis for building the houses that would, inevitably, destroy what made it a desirable destination in the first place.

[STEVE G]

Traditionally speaking, you needed a church to be a village, a market to be a town and a cathedral to be a city but I believe that was just a rule of thumb and that's why you can find plenty of exceptions. Near where I'm from in Notts there is a pleasant small town called Southwell which has a large Minster, a cathedral like building from mediaeval times which has a bishop but it isn't a city.

[arcadianagain]

I beleive that every so often towns apply to the Queen to become a city but only one is chosen. I suspect that many football fans can remember when Swansea City was once Swansea Town

[Jimbob]

(Ooo, there's another question - when does a village become a town?)

umm from an-named source (wiki)
In England, a civil parish is a territorial designation which is the lowest tier of local government below districts and counties, or their combined form, the unitary authority. It is an administrative parish, in contrast to an ecclesiastical parish.

A civil parish can range in size from a large town with a population of around 80,000 to a single village with fewer than a hundred inhabitants. In a limited number of cases a parish might include a whole city where city status has been granted by the Monarch. Reflecting this diverse nature, a civil parish may be known as a town, village, neighbourhood or community by resolution of its parish council. Approximately 35% of the English population live in a civil parish. As at 31 December 2010 there were 10,479 parishes in England.[2]

On 1 April 2014, Queen's Park became the first civil parish in Greater London.[3] Before 2008 their creation was not permitted within a London borough.[4]

[dtaai-maai]

Time to get the little grey cells working again.

I am a fictional character, probably as well known as my creator, for whom I am a mouthpiece. I am for everyone, and yet I am for no one. My real-life namesake was the founder of an ancient religion.

Who am I?

Feel free to use Google. Questions are welcome.