Cost of living in Hua Hin

[Big Boy]

For the third and final time, please get this thread back on topic. If it remains off topic, all irrelevant posts will be removed from the thread.

Hua Hin Forum provides sufficient forums to permit you to discuss a variety of subjects - there is very little restriction on discussion if carried out in the correct place. If you wish to discuss food, please discuss it in the Feeding Time forum. This thread is about the Cost of living in Hua Hin.

[margaretcarnes]

HHF ----my sentiments entirely

Lomu ---spot on. I much prefer living in a Thai area rather than an enclave of Brits, Swedes, Germans or Norwegians

I came to Thailand to retire but wanted to integrate into their culture. Seems many do not share my view

Spot on guys. Back in the UK people are uncomfortable with the 'ghettos' of immigrants. There's no reason why HH's local population should feel any differently IMO - and with justification. Seeing large gated villas out in the sticks is bound to lead to envy and resentment, which often results in crime as well.
But there is also an ongoing feeling throughout this thread that if - as a farang - you haven't achieved the status of property and belongings by retirement age you are something of an oddball failure.
Caller made a good point earlier that it could be an age gap thing. Younger people are of course still ambitious to achieve their goals - the cars, houses, boats etc. And that in a way is good because it motivates them to do well. What they sometimes fail to realise is that a) some of us in the age group of Richard and myself recognise that 'things' don't always bring long term happiness and that b) we were brought up to be self sufficient and happy with our lot.
There are just more 'things' out there now which are marketed well and become must haves, without which people don't feel their lives are complete.
I've just downsized home wise and believe me there was a lot of c..p I found I could very easily do without, and not for the first time either! I don't need lots of stuff to dust. Don't want to spend most of my time on routine maintenance. Can only wear so many pairs of shoes for example. And haven't needed a car for 12 years. It needn't cost a lot to pursue hobbies and interests either and I don't sit indoors and fester because downsizing frees up more spare cash to do things - and some of the things I do are starting to turn a profit anyway.
It's about priorities as you get older - not sacrifices. Family and friends are important - not things. Giving something back to your community is important too.
And as for the market shopping issue - again an age thing IMO. My Dad, Grandad and Great Grandad were all market butchers and I know (and remember) that hygeine wasn't brilliant in my local UK wet market. Far from it. We survived the bugs though and ChatChai market has never held any terrors for me as a result. At least they still sell good honest meat on the bone and chops with the kidneys attached!

[johnnyk]

Cook it well and no worries. Westerners have become afraid of everything.

[Whaler]

If you want to sit indoors and eat bread, rice, potatoes etc or whatever is your stable food there is little gain moving elsewhere

If you want to capitalise on selling your bigger house and buying a cheaper one then there are bargains in many rural areas of Europe and elsewhere

When you start to factor other items your choice of location soon becomes more limited e.g.

Warm climate and minimal tropical storms or adverse weather or geophysical events (ie don’t want to be cold for 5 months of the year or rained in)
Indigenous low paid workforce compared to your home country (Makes services cheap)
Not an isolated island (Automatically increases costs )
Industrialisation and major airport/hub (Makes access easier and local consumer goods cheap, increase choices)
Culture/Religion (Brings richness/diversity and tolerance)
Tourism (Brings western creature comforts, services and language)
Expat community (Increase social life style)
Safety, Stability, Economy

Of course some of these choices have a downside but are usual outweighed by the pros, if it’s not to liking simple increase or decrease the choices

Those who choose LOS/HH for the climate will naturally find they will spend more simply as activities are available all year round where most will be huddling around the fire for 5 months of the year in Europe or when their resort town shuts down for the winter.

Any country that has an indigenous workforce whose salary is several factors cheaper than you native country has to yield saving unless you counter this by taking advantage of other services you simple could not afford otherwise.

Once you step outside of your house and engage in activities be it dinning, drinking, sports, travel etc you will incur cost and depends on your lifestyle, but if mimicked in your home country it’s still likely to be cheaper in LOS/HH

Although the long termers here have good advice they are somewhat stuck with reminiscing when things use to be cheaper or the exchange rates were better, newbie’s like they once were will now be judging based on current circumstances and their salaries/pensions now and not 5,10,15 years back.

As for ageism and/or generation gap I think this is more to do with what you have forgotten or can’t be bothered or learn/change than re-focusing on important things IMO

[hhfarang]

Although the long termers here have good advice they are somewhat stuck with reminiscing when things use to be cheaper or the exchange rates were better, newbie’s like they once were will now be judging based on current circumstances and their salaries/pensions now and not 5,10,15 years back.

Exactly, and what I'm trying to tell the newbies and prospective immigrants to Thailand is that they have to think about and plan carefully for what the exchange rate, prices, economies will be like 5,10,15 years from now... that's what I failed to do!

Maybe you can live on 50k now, but you may need three times that much in 10 years so you'd better plan to have too much, and not too little income and savings.

[Siani]

Although the long termers here have good advice they are somewhat stuck with reminiscing when things use to be cheaper or the exchange rates were better, newbie’s like they once were will now be judging based on current circumstances and their salaries/pensions now and not 5,10,15 years back.

Exactly, and what I'm trying to tell the newbies and prospective immigrants to Thailand is that they have to think about and plan carefully for what the exchange rate, prices, economies will be like 5,10,15 years from now... that's what I failed to do!

Maybe you can live on 50k now, but you may need three times that much in 10 years so you'd better plan to have too much, and not too little income and savings.

I do think that is wise advice, the rate is not brilliant. Someone else mention too that with the Thai government, it is difficult to predict what changes there may or may not be that apply to foreigners.
Everything must be considered when making the big move.

[dtaai-maai]

This is not a dig at anybody, but I can't help thinking that if I did half as much planning and forward-thinking as is being suggested, I'd never have gone anywhere; I'd be in a safe little job with a safe little pension back in the UK or wherever. I doubt that's the sort of life that would really suit many expats of any nationality, otherwise they wouldn't be here (or anywhere else) in the first place. There are always risks in life. Some you win, some you lose.
There are public servants in Greece who thought they were on a nice little earner 2 years ago - now they're up the creek without a paddle. It can happen to anyone. There's no need to take stupid risks, but you might as well get on with life and have some fun and hope it lasts.

[Pagey]

Agree DM

A guy I used to work with who lives in Patts now told me 'if you wait until you have enough money to retire to thailand you will never have enough'.

And I have been guilty of moving my own goal posts many times although with the exchange rate drop and interest rate drop a couple of years ago I am glad I did !!

NB : Roll on 31st January 2012 and my scheduled redundancy/retirement

[STEVE G]

Maybe you can live on 50k now, but you may need three times that much in 10 years so you'd better plan to have too much, and not too little income and savings.

Yes and to be honest this is the big problem with retiring anywhere in the world at the moment and not just in Thailand.
The world seems to be in danger of experiencing a large degree of inflation in the next decade which makes retiring a risky business. For this reason I plan to cut back on work as I get older but not stop until I absolutely have to for health reasons or lack of work.
Whatever happens I intend to spend as much time as I can in Asia as I don't see any advantage to hanging around in Europe when I'm not working, however much or little money I have.

[johnnyk]

Agree DM

A guy I used to work with who lives in Patts now told me 'if you wait until you have enough money to retire to thailand you will never have enough'.

And I have been guilty of moving my own goal posts many times although with the exchange rate drop and interest rate drop a couple of years ago I am glad I did !!

NB : Roll on 31st January 2012 and my scheduled redundancy/retirement

What di John Lennon say? Life is what happens while you are making plans or similar.

[Whaler]

Exactly, and what I'm trying to tell the newbies and prospective immigrants to Thailand is that they have to think about and plan carefully for what the exchange rate, prices, economies will be like 5,10,15 years from now... that's what I failed to do!

Maybe you can live on 50k now, but you may need three times that much in 10 years so you'd better plan to have too much, and not too little income and savings.

Exactly if you try to do it on a tight budget from the start you will have little room to manoeuvre if things go wrong

Keeping it simple and as crude budget you need account for doubling your monthly/annual budget every 10 years assuming this is savings that also earn interest. Or if a fixed pension you need to be investing the delta over your budget for at least 10 years to help towards the next 20.

Keeping reasonable savings say 3-5 years budget in home country and LOS is a simple hedging philosophy

If helps if you also have a property in your home land that is rented out and can eventually be sold 10-20 years down the line as this takes a big edge off the inflation factors.

Of course this is all fine, but you want to be young enough to enjoy the little you have. I would guess in today’s climate most people’s calculations have been extended by 3-5 years, unless your lucky enough to be able to do some part time consultancy.

[margaretcarnes]

Whaler - 'but you want to be young enough to enjoy the little you have' !
With respect that's just the kind of viewpoint I've been railing against. It just enforces the age divide and perception of older expats IMO - i.e that they are too old to be able to enjoy whatever they have left (be it time or cash presumably?)

It's true that a tight budget from the start isn't very wise - the old saying about how to make a million in Thailand still holds good. Start with 10 million. But at the same time there's never a right time to make the move. As already pointed out by A N Other pensions and investments can't be assured anywhere now. Go for it when you feel it is right. There are younger HH expats who have done that and - out of need and motivation - have made good lives there.
There just happen to be more expats at the moment who are older and, because of the nature of work and industry when they started out on their careers, have had to wait until retirement to head for the sun. We must also remember that when todays retiree expats first started work - and started their pension pots - many had never even heard of Thailand let alone imagined being able to ever retire to such a far flung place.
Fortunately the world is shrinking and work needn't mean being tied to a desk in your home country anymore. There is much more opportunity and scope for people now to go and work where the spirit moves.
I think that as a result the expat demographic is slowly - but noticeably - changing and that both ends of the age spectrum should try to appreciate the others differences in opportunities, threats, wants, needs, and motivation.

[kalbow]

Keeping it simple and as crude budget you need account for doubling your monthly/annual budget every 10 years assuming this is savings that also earn interest.

Whaler, presumably the doubling of a budget amount you quoted is as a result of currency fluctuations right? Otherwise, are we saying that inflation is running around 8.5% per annum in LOS?

Kalbow

[STEVE G]

Keeping it simple and as crude budget you need account for doubling your monthly/annual budget every 10 years assuming this is savings that also earn interest.

Whaler, presumably the doubling of a budget amount you quoted is as a result of currency fluctuations right? Otherwise, are we saying that inflation is running around 8.5% per annum in LOS?

Kalbow

It's at about 4% at the moment but it did go over 8% in 2008.

[Whaler]

Keeping it simple and as crude budget you need account for doubling your monthly/annual budget every 10 years assuming this is savings that also earn interest.

Whaler, presumably the doubling of a budget amount you quoted is as a result of currency fluctuations right? Otherwise, are we saying that inflation is running around 8.5% per annum in LOS?

Kalbow

It really depends how complicated you make your budget if it includes or excludes major purchases (car) or renovations etc and if S**T happens rules

My simple 2x10 years excludes majors, emergeney and currency. It also assumes your savings would be halving the inflation factor to a degree, depending how big your pot is. Currency is too hard to factor and best done by simple savings hedging in 2 currencies. Of course you need not be so hard on yourself if you also downsize car/boat etc or dependants drop-off over the period