Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

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buksida
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by buksida »

Big Boy wrote: Sat Oct 14, 2023 11:16 am I honestly can't see what taxation will have to do with Immigration.
Big Boy wrote: Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:19 am I still don't believe it will be an Immigration job. Immigration are there to check on Immigration. The revenue department collect taxes. It's a bit like the bin men popping in to check your plumbing every time they collect bins.
It would be the easiest way to enforce the tax collection or proof of payment for foreigners. Immigration already checks tax payment status for non-B visa renewals so the system is already in place. No document (its called a PND 91) from the tax department proving you've paid this year? No visa renewal. Its easy enforcement if they want to take this route, and we know how much Thailand loves its paperwork and making as many hoops to jump through as possible.

But I hope for all our sakes you're right and it has nothing to do with immigration.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by Big Boy »

Interesting. My proof of having already paid tax would be my P60, and for me, which coincidentally, it arrives a couple of weeks before my visa renewal. I guess I'd have to use it to get my PND 91 (just guessing). However, I renew in June each year. How would a P60 work December/January if my renewal was then?

I think this is going to be one of those things that will be made up as they go along, and it'll be a case of wait and see. I'm not worried, and if the worse comes to the worse, somebody has already mentioned a number. It will be annoying, but shouldn't break anybody's bank.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by timuphill »

Maybe this article has already been posted here?
It seems that next year Thailand will be serious about collecting overseas taxes. But how it will be done, not even Thais know that. This will be another do-as-you-go law, as all new laws are here.... just a HUGE mess and will end up hurting Thailand more than anyone else.

My main worry is that the documents that we may have to show to prove our overseas income, etc. must be translated into Thai, which would be very costly. How would Thai authorities be able to read different bank statements, tax returns, etc. that are written in 150 different languages?

https://scandasia.com/more-details-on-t ... as-income/
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by Big Boy »

They manage to read my monthly Credit Advices, which are produced in English by Kasikorn Bank.

It will be like most Government Policies, not just Thailand. The man at the top says, "Make it so," and the poor Civil Servants have to pick the mess apart and come up with something workable, which in this case I presume is 1st January.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by malcolminthemiddle »

STEVE G wrote: Sun Oct 15, 2023 3:22 pm
That was why on Friday I quoted this from the ruling:

"...— from employment, a business carried on overseas, or property situated overseas — that is brought into Thailand should be subject to personal income tax...."

Because that does not say all money brought into Thailand.
Where does this quote come from please? It does not appear in the Revenue Department Order No. P.161/2023 posted in the Royal Gazette. Order P.161/2023 does however refer to assessable income which is defined in Section 40 of the Thai Income Tax Law here https://www.thailandlawonline.com/reven ... ue-code#ii
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by HHTel »

Well I'll do what I've always done. Ignore these 'announcements' until something actually happens. Many of these so called scares in the past have never actually come to fruition. Although it states from Jan 2024 I'm sure there will be the inevitable delay due to relevant depts are not up to speed.

Until I'm forced to do something, I'll do nothing.

I'll just wait and see.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by STEVE G »

malcolminthemiddle wrote: Mon Oct 16, 2023 11:56 am
STEVE G wrote: Sun Oct 15, 2023 3:22 pm
That was why on Friday I quoted this from the ruling:

"...— from employment, a business carried on overseas, or property situated overseas — that is brought into Thailand should be subject to personal income tax...."

Because that does not say all money brought into Thailand.
Where does this quote come from please? It does not appear in the Revenue Department Order No. P.161/2023 posted in the Royal Gazette. Order P.161/2023 does however refer to assessable income which is defined in Section 40 of the Thai Income Tax Law here https://www.thailandlawonline.com/reven ... ue-code#ii
They have a similar definition here:

https://www.rd.go.th/english/6045.html

But that is also not all money brought into Thailand, it's basically forms of income, it wouldn't include money from savings.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by 404cameljockey »

thecolonel wrote: Sun Oct 15, 2023 12:37 pm We were discussing this yesterday and someone had been told that it's not the expats they are targeting, more Thais who work abroad and bring earned money into Thailand

We'll see...

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Nets designed for big fish also end up catching small fish. The question is will they be thrown back or accepted as bonus government income?

As others have said, as someone who has what I'd describe as unearned income as the sole basis of my life here I'm going to ignore all of this until such time as it comes into effect, the amount of words being expended on it by expats around the country is truly insane at this stage, TIT, we don't actually know how anything works until after it happens.

This is my one and only post on this until something concrete happens. :)
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by STEVE G »

Whilst I agree it might come to nothing, I'm planning on retiring to Thailand in the next few years and it certainly seems prudent to take this change of law into account when making plans.
I'm more interested in strategies to minimise any tax paid and I already see some possible loopholes.
Incidentally, it occurs to me that this whole thing could have been put into place due to one high net worth individual who recently returned to Thailand.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by thecolonel »

STEVE G wrote:Whilst I agree it might come to nothing, I'm planning on retiring to Thailand in the next few years and it certainly seems prudent to take this change of law into account when making plans.
I'm more interested in strategies to minimise any tax paid and I already see some possible loopholes.
Incidentally, it occurs to me that this whole thing could have been put into place due to one high net worth individual who recently returned to Thailand.
But as you astutely point out savings are not earned income which is what they're after(we think anyway)

Depends what you're planning to live off when here I guess

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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by malcolminthemiddle »

Section 42 of the Thai Income Tax Law describes 25 categories of income that are exempt from personal income tax. I suspect most people can identify with one or more categories that apply to them if the worst comes to the worst. # 10 inheritance and #s 23 and 24 sale and income from mutual funds were the exemptions that caught my eye.

https://www.thailandlawonline.com/reven ... ue-code#ii
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by Scout »

Big Boy wrote: Sun Oct 15, 2023 8:19 am I still don't believe it will be an Immigration job. Immigration are there to check on Immigration. The revenue department collect taxes. It's a bit like the bin men popping in to check your plumbing every time they collect bins.
But wouldn’t this be a situation very similar to when Thailand started requiring Health Insurance for those with Non-OA visas ? I’ve been caught up in this requirement for several years now and I can assure you it’s the Immigration department that enforces this requirement. Perhaps this isn’t the best analogy ???
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by Big Boy »

The difference is the Health Insurance only affected foreigners. The tax thing applies to everybody that resides in Thailand, Thai and foreign.
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Re: Tax residency in Thailand and taxing overseas income

Post by PET »

Thank you very much for this - easily the most sensible and authoritative comments I have seen in the posts on this matter.
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