Big Boy's recent post about his son's dual nationality has got me thinking. I knew that Dual nationality could only be held by Thai men until aged 20 (presumably to ensure that they don't try and get all the rights of a Thai whilst evading national service) but how is it enforced?
Has anyone actually been through this at age 20 of their dual nationality son?
For the context, Big Boy's original thread is here:
http://www.huahinafterdark.com/forum/vi ... php?t=2811
Dual Nationality
Not exactly through it but maybe some info. My son had dual nationality but age 20 came and went and he remained in the USA. He's now done some investigating on his own (where I don't know) and has been told that at anytime he wanted to immigrate to Thailand in his life, he could based upon his birth documents. He doesn't know at the moment if that would mean he would have to renounce his US Citizenship to become a permanent resident or citizen of Thailand.
For my daughter, nothing was applicable as the first Mrs. Pete became a US citizen before her birth, therefore she did not have the Thai option. Pete
For my daughter, nothing was applicable as the first Mrs. Pete became a US citizen before her birth, therefore she did not have the Thai option. Pete
Our nipper is only 18 months old so I cant give you any solid info but I have met a couple of luuk kreungs that retain dual nationality and are over 20. Basically when in Thailand they are Thai (with ID card and passport), they enter and leave on these. When anywhere else in the world they use their British (or wherever) passport.
The British government accepts dual nationality but the Thai government does not so as long as they have all the relevent Thai documents the powers that be will be none the wiser. I guess the evasion of national service was done by not being in the country at the time.
The British government accepts dual nationality but the Thai government does not so as long as they have all the relevent Thai documents the powers that be will be none the wiser. I guess the evasion of national service was done by not being in the country at the time.
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
Buksida wrote:
Regarding
However, doing it in reverse, I assume my son would have to keep his Thai visa up to date, else he would never be able to get out of Thailand without a lot of hassle involved in getting a UK visa (or wherever) on his Thai Passport.
National Service was a question I specifically asked the Thai Embassy about - they did not include an answer in their reply.I guess the evasion of national service was done by not being in the country at the time.
Regarding
thats exactly what my wife has been doing for the last 10 years - if you don't tell anyone, nobody knows.The British government accepts dual nationality but the Thai government does not so as long as they have all the relevent Thai documents the powers that be will be none the wiser.
However, doing it in reverse, I assume my son would have to keep his Thai visa up to date, else he would never be able to get out of Thailand without a lot of hassle involved in getting a UK visa (or wherever) on his Thai Passport.
I could be wrong but if he already has a Thai passport he doesnt need visas, he comes and goes as he pleases and vice versa with the UK passport. Thats why the ideal situation is to have both.I assume my son would have to keep his Thai visa up to date, else he would never be able to get out of Thailand without a lot of hassle involved in getting a UK visa (or wherever) on his Thai Passport.
We've just got my sons Thai passport, in and out within an hour. Now I have to register his birth with the British embassy then he will be eligable for a UK passport and should be covered from then on.
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
Buksida,
You seem to have missed the point - from the age of 20, if he doesn't keep the Thai visa up to date in his UK passport, and he chooses to leave Thailand at a later date, he will either suffer a massive overstay fine, or have to obtain a visa in his Thai passport to travel to where ever (not an easy task).
Or am I missing a point somewhere?
I usually get my wife to travel everywhere on her UK passport because her Thai passport isn't worth the paper its printed on. This means obtaining a visa if we make an extended visit to Thailand.
If we experience a problem, and I hope we never do, its so much easier to move through other countries with a UK passport.
You seem to have missed the point - from the age of 20, if he doesn't keep the Thai visa up to date in his UK passport, and he chooses to leave Thailand at a later date, he will either suffer a massive overstay fine, or have to obtain a visa in his Thai passport to travel to where ever (not an easy task).
Or am I missing a point somewhere?
I usually get my wife to travel everywhere on her UK passport because her Thai passport isn't worth the paper its printed on. This means obtaining a visa if we make an extended visit to Thailand.
If we experience a problem, and I hope we never do, its so much easier to move through other countries with a UK passport.
Looks like it.Big Boy wrote:You seem to have missed the point
Totally confused now
Why does he need a visa for Thailand in his UK passport if he has a Thai passport? Enter and leave Thailand on that, they need never know he has the UK pp.
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
Buksida wrote:
I think the average Thai believes it is virtually impossible to get a visa in their Thai passport to visit the UK - of course thats what the British Embassy in Bangkok wants them to believe.
Although not impossible to do, I think it is just too much hassle to travel on a Thai passport.
I have arranged numerous visas for Thais to come to the UK on their Thai Passports - although not that difficult, the process is time consuming, you need a sponsor and also have to present a lot of documentation.Thai passport? Enter and leave Thailand on that, they need never know he has the UK pp.
I think the average Thai believes it is virtually impossible to get a visa in their Thai passport to visit the UK - of course thats what the British Embassy in Bangkok wants them to believe.
Although not impossible to do, I think it is just too much hassle to travel on a Thai passport.
I agree with buksida. When we leave the UK, we use the UK passports. When we arrive in LoS, everyone except me uses their Thai passports but I join the Thai nationals queue with them.
On the way back we use Thai passports to leave Thailand and the UK ones to get back into Britain.
There are problems with this though. For example, when the wife renews her Thai passport it will no longer have the Indefinite Leave to Remain stamp in it, so she won't be able to use it to get on the plane back to the UK at BKK. I think you can re-establish the stamp by sending it off to the Immigration & Nationality Directorate but it costs a hundred pounds or so.
One thing that always amazes me (and we forget everytime, so the Thai airport officials treat us like shit - surely the most arrogant and miserable people in Thailand) is that the departure card MUST be filled out in English, even if you are Thai and even though the questions are in both Thai and English.
On the way back we use Thai passports to leave Thailand and the UK ones to get back into Britain.
There are problems with this though. For example, when the wife renews her Thai passport it will no longer have the Indefinite Leave to Remain stamp in it, so she won't be able to use it to get on the plane back to the UK at BKK. I think you can re-establish the stamp by sending it off to the Immigration & Nationality Directorate but it costs a hundred pounds or so.
One thing that always amazes me (and we forget everytime, so the Thai airport officials treat us like shit - surely the most arrogant and miserable people in Thailand) is that the departure card MUST be filled out in English, even if you are Thai and even though the questions are in both Thai and English.
Jaime,
Thank you for confirming Buksida's comments. I'm talking on here because I want to learn, and all information is gratefully received.
You say
My misconception centres around leaving Thailand on a Thai passport without a visa - to obtain a visa would be costly/time consuming. I think you are agreeing with this.
Thank you for confirming Buksida's comments. I'm talking on here because I want to learn, and all information is gratefully received.
You say
I had always assumed the Thai immigration service was joined up, and would be wise to such initiatives. Maybe its just my mind working overtime thinking through problems that don't exist.On the way back we use Thai passports to leave Thailand and the UK ones to get back into Britain.
My misconception centres around leaving Thailand on a Thai passport without a visa - to obtain a visa would be costly/time consuming. I think you are agreeing with this.
Totally agree with that sentiment - its a real pain having to complete cards for any Thai travelling companions. When my daughter and her family visit the UK, I normally fill in a couple of spares that I keep for such occassions, and mail them out.the departure card MUST be filled out in English, even if you are Thai and even though the questions are in both Thai and English.
Big Boy,
I don't mean to cross swords with you, but if my wife and I had a child in Thailand and it was correctly registered with the Thai authorities and they had a Thai ID card and Thai passport first, the parents should then go to the Brit Emb and correctly apply for a Brit passport. That lucky child would have dual nationality.
I've always thought that the key for a child being born in Thailand was that they had to be registered with the Thai authorities first.
So, holding two passports, my child exits Thailand on their Thai passport, enters the UK on the relevant one and vice versa.
If an immigration officer asks where are the exit stamps are, the child can simply show the other totally official passport and explain.
Maybe, youre getting confused with a luuk kreung who is born in Thailand. If the other way around,I'm sure that Thailand would have something to say about that.
It's Thai nationality first and whatever second.
Excuse me if I'm wrong.
I don't mean to cross swords with you, but if my wife and I had a child in Thailand and it was correctly registered with the Thai authorities and they had a Thai ID card and Thai passport first, the parents should then go to the Brit Emb and correctly apply for a Brit passport. That lucky child would have dual nationality.
I've always thought that the key for a child being born in Thailand was that they had to be registered with the Thai authorities first.
So, holding two passports, my child exits Thailand on their Thai passport, enters the UK on the relevant one and vice versa.
If an immigration officer asks where are the exit stamps are, the child can simply show the other totally official passport and explain.
Maybe, youre getting confused with a luuk kreung who is born in Thailand. If the other way around,I'm sure that Thailand would have something to say about that.
It's Thai nationality first and whatever second.
Excuse me if I'm wrong.
lomuamart,
By no means do I take any advice as crossing swords - all advice is gratefully received.
A couple of points of clarification please:
* My son was born in England to a Thai mother.
* Advice has been given to me by the Thai Embassy in London which is quoted on another thread, which in turn prompted this thread ie http://www.huahinafterdark.com/forum/vi ... php?t=2811
* I think your cunning plan hits a problem when your child is 20
* Second time I've heard it - what is a luuk kreung?
Do the above points affect what you have written, or does your statement still stand please?
By no means do I take any advice as crossing swords - all advice is gratefully received.
A couple of points of clarification please:
* My son was born in England to a Thai mother.
* Advice has been given to me by the Thai Embassy in London which is quoted on another thread, which in turn prompted this thread ie http://www.huahinafterdark.com/forum/vi ... php?t=2811
* I think your cunning plan hits a problem when your child is 20
* Second time I've heard it - what is a luuk kreung?
Do the above points affect what you have written, or does your statement still stand please?
This is probably where we were crossing wires.Big Boy wrote: * My son was born in England to a Thai mother.
So what happens when he's 20? Does it effect luuk kreungs born in Thailand?Big Boy wrote:* I think your cunning plan hits a problem when your child is 20
Also looking advice as contrary to popular belief I don't know it all
Who is the happier man, he who has braved the storm of life and lived or he who has stayed securely on shore and merely existed? - Hunter S Thompson
Buksida,
It will probably help if you see a copy of what the Thai Embassy in London sent me:
You son will be eligible to apply for Thai nationality by registering the birth at the Royal Thai Embassy in London. This would enble him to live in Thailand as a Thai citizen and of cause he can study and work there. He can hold dual nationality untill he turn 20. For details please visit www.thaiembassyuk.org.uk
Please note: the British full birth certificate must be legalised by the FCO and certified by the Royal Thai Embassy in London. Please refer to website http://www.thaiembassyuk.org.uk/legal.htm
Royal Thai Embassy
It will probably help if you see a copy of what the Thai Embassy in London sent me:
You son will be eligible to apply for Thai nationality by registering the birth at the Royal Thai Embassy in London. This would enble him to live in Thailand as a Thai citizen and of cause he can study and work there. He can hold dual nationality untill he turn 20. For details please visit www.thaiembassyuk.org.uk
Please note: the British full birth certificate must be legalised by the FCO and certified by the Royal Thai Embassy in London. Please refer to website http://www.thaiembassyuk.org.uk/legal.htm
Royal Thai Embassy