Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

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Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Nereus » Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:59 am

Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

https://thenewdaily.com.au/money/financ ... _PM_Update

The Airbus A380 superjumbo will remain in production for at least another 10 years, after Dubai-based airline Emirates signed a deal to purchase up to 36 new aircraft.

News of the $22 billion deal comes just days after Airbus warned it would have shut down production of the aircraft if it received no new orders in 2018.

The enormous A380, while a hit with the public, has proved difficult to sell, and until today had only taken a total of 317 orders since its launch in 2007. Half of those came from Emirates.

In 2017, Airbus did not take a single order for a new A380, and on Monday chief operating officer John Leahy warned if the firm didn’t receive at least six orders in 2018, production what have to cease.

Emirates singlehandedly kept production alive on Thursday when it committed to buying 20 new A380s, with the option of buying a further 16, in a deal worth as much as $US16 billion ($22 billion).

The agreement hands a lifeline to the slow-selling aircraft, in service for just 10 years, and rescues one of Europe’s most visible industrial symbols overseas.

Airbus shares rose more than 3 per cent after the announcement to touch a record high.

The deal ends months of tough-fought negotiations. Talks between Airbus and Emirates about a fresh A380 order broke down at the last minute at the Dubai Airshow in November, when the Gulf carrier placed an order for 40 smaller Boeing 787s.

Emirates and Airbus both said the deal would bring stability to the A380 production line.

Emirates has built much of its network and brand around the 544-seat A380 superjumbo but is also the world’s largest operator of twin-engined Boeing 777s which carry up to 400 people in their newest version now in development.

Emirates’ A380 fleet operates both Engine Alliance and Rolls-Royce engines. The airline said it was evaluating its engine options for the latest order.

Engine Alliance is co-owned by General Electric and Pratt & Whitney.

The agreement calls for Emirates to take six aircraft a year for a decade as Airbus looks for other A380 business, filling a gap in planned production, a person familiar with the deal said.

Analysts say Airbus was unlikely to break even on the A380 at such production levels, but that the losses would not make a big impact on the company’s accounts, which are dominated by sales of smaller jets worth tens of billions of dollars a year.
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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by stretch » Sat Jan 20, 2018 4:10 pm

the only plane that gives cattle class some sort of comfort

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Thistle » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:57 pm

Does not compare to the best aircraft ever a 747,first/business/economy,,,,,,,,,,,anywhere around the world.
The A380,will not continue,,,,,,,,,,the likes of the Dreamliner will totally take over Emirates fleet,the A380 is not a viable aircraft,
Consider 300 plus manufactured,Emirates alone flying 100 plus,,,,,,,,,,,,,,no other airline interested,,,,,,,,,,,,
I think the OP [Extinction] might be very possible.Of course how many airports can cope or have altered there set up to receive a double decker,i think a few!!

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Dannie Boy » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:18 pm

Thistle wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:57 pm
Does not compare to the best aircraft ever a 747,first/business/economy,,,,,,,,,,,anywhere around the world.
The A380,will not continue,,,,,,,,,,the likes of the Dreamliner will totally take over Emirates fleet,the A380 is not a viable aircraft,
Consider 300 plus manufactured,Emirates alone flying 100 plus,,,,,,,,,,,,,,no other airline interested,,,,,,,,,,,,
I think the OP [Extinction] might be very possible.Of course how many airports can cope or have altered there set up to receive a double decker,i think a few!!
I have to disagree - I have flown BC in both a 747&380 and the 380 wins hands down in my opinion - the upper deck on a 380 is whisper quiet.

They might face a very uncertain future in terms of future sales, but having invested about $400m per plane, airlines that have them in their fleet will be forced to maximize their utilization

I believe that n 2016 there were 76 airports that could handle a 380, no doubt this will be a little higher now.

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by MDMK » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:30 pm

I too disagree, the A380 is FAR better than the 747

business and first class in the A380 especially

With Emirates A380 just being able to go back and forward to the bar, or sit there for a while is a massive bonus ... and I don't even drink! It just kills time and makes flying so much more pleasant.

I have only flown first class in the A380 once and the shower was fantastic, again another great way to kill boredom on a long flight

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Thistle » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:31 pm

Good comments from the above 2 posters,it however does not take away from the fact that,being able to go back for a juice/champagne/beer/wine,or the flight being whisper quiet,i do not believe this will save the A380.Apart from Emirates,no other airline has re-ordered,and,,,,,,,,, that has to be a negative outlook.I fly twice a month,,,,,,,,and now very happy flying triple 777,Qatar/Emirates/Etihad,I choose not to fly A380.

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Thistle » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:37 pm

Final comment,British Airways london/hong kong/anchoridge/london,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,first class,nothing in the world could compete then!!I know times have changed,lol.

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by MDMK » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:22 pm

Thistle, I spent an hour or two the other day reading about the non-viability of the A380, and it had nothing to with customer satisfaction. Overall the A380 is very popular with passengers. It's airline execs it's not so popular with, not the customers.

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Thistle » Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:29 pm

MDMK,i understand to an extent what you are saying,however,the fact is that only ONE,major airline is placing new orders has to be significant,
Ok,Emirates are regarded very highly worldwide,but why are the airlines who initially placed orders and are currently flying the A380 not re-ordering,and cancelling and buying other Airbus products.
Being popular with passengers is all well and good,,,,,,you have to fill a A380 and that takes a lot of seats,say 500plus,it is not going to be viable on many routes,especially when you consider seasonal trade.

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by MDMK » Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:13 pm

Thistle, it's not viable - on that we agree. And the fact it will be extinct pretty soon confirms that.

That viability though isn't down to the customer being unhappy with it, which is what you implied earlier when you said the perks of a bar couldn't be compared to the quietness of (I'm assuming) the Dreamliner. The A380 scored well on all fronts with passengers.

Customers on the whole ARE very happy with the A380.
Airlines on the whole aren't ordering A380s.

From what I could work out it has more to do with the "inflexibility" of the aircraft (can't easily be used on shorthaul flights, isn't as flexible to send on other routes as it needs specially equipped airports - for runway length and for getting in and out of the plane, read a lot of points mentioning second hand value wouldn't be great and that had to do with budget airlines would never use that kind of plane on 99% of their routes)

So I absolutely don't disagree with you that the A380 will be dead as a dodo in a few years time

All I disagree with was your points regarding passenger satisfaction, because that is not at all the reason it isn't selling

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Homer » Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:30 pm

Thistle wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:29 pm
Ok,Emirates are regarded very highly worldwide,but why are the airlines who initially placed orders and are currently flying the A380 not re-ordering,and cancelling and buying other Airbus products.
When this story broke a few days ago the business press explained airlines must adapt to change. Almost all airlines that bought the A380 have since changed their routing models for competitive reasons. The A380 no longer fits well.

It fits Emirates well for most (all?) of their routes that pass through Dubai. They handle all such flights in one 8 hour nighttime shift. Nighttime because those working outside are more productive. An aircraft burns less fuel climbing out in lower temperatures. Hot air is bumpy air, so passengers get a smoother ride at night. It will be interesting to see how the 787 affects such operations.

My only problem with Emirates is there are 2 A380 cabin versions in business class. One lie flat seat is substantially more comfortable than the other. Unfortunately, there is no way at booking time to know which one you'll get. But even the less desirable one beats cattle class by a huge margin.

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Bluesky » Sun Jan 21, 2018 1:34 am

Homer wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:30 pm
Thistle wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:29 pm
Ok,Emirates are regarded very highly worldwide,but why are the airlines who initially placed orders and are currently flying the A380 not re-ordering,and cancelling and buying other Airbus products.
When this story broke a few days ago the business press explained airlines must adapt to change. Almost all airlines that bought the A380 have since changed their routing models for competitive reasons. The A380 no longer fits well.

It fits Emirates well for most (all?) of their routes that pass through Dubai. They handle all such flights in one 8 hour nighttime shift. Nighttime because those working outside are more productive. An aircraft burns less fuel climbing out in lower temperatures. Hot air is bumpy air, so passengers get a smoother ride at night. It will be interesting to see how the 787 affects such operations.

My only problem with Emirates is there are 2 A380 cabin versions in business class. One lie flat seat is substantially more comfortable than the other. Unfortunately, there is no way at booking time to know which one you'll get. But even the less desirable one beats cattle class by a huge margin.
Irrespective of the viability of the A380, Emirates have invested heavily in infrastructure specifically designed around the A380. Typically, their A380 purpose designed hub, opened in 2013 at a cost of some 3.27 billion, USD. I doubt very much that the decision to purchase was based purely on economic performance of the A380 alone.
https://www.emirates.com/english/experi ... -a380-hub/
https://cdn.ek.aero/downloads/ek/pdfs/c ... _facts.pdf
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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by Homer » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:53 am

Bluesky wrote:
Sun Jan 21, 2018 1:34 am
Irrespective of the viability of the A380, Emirates have invested heavily in infrastructure specifically designed around the A380.
Wasn't that made clear in the OP?
Nereus wrote:
Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:59 am
Emirates has built much of its network and brand around the 544-seat A380 superjumbo

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by usual suspect » Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:33 am

A mate & I were chatting one evening, & the subject of my Emirates flight was mentioned..
... I told my mate that my A380 rtn flight was the cheapest I'd paid in years (£384), He then went on to tell me that no A380 in the sky today has ever met the fuel consumption figures that Airbus initially quoted..& couple that with Emirates having more 380's than all the rest of the world's airlines..means they need 'bums on seats'..these planes need to be full. Now I can mend the tractor with gaffer tape, but airline economics may IMO need an extra roll.. :thumb:

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Re: Airbus A380 superjumbo saved from extinction by Emirates

Post by J.J.B. » Sun Jan 21, 2018 4:01 pm

usual suspect wrote:
Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:33 am
...no A380 in the sky today has ever met the fuel consumption figures that Airbus initially quoted
Jet A-1 fuel is probably one of the things the Middle East airlines care less about, not least because they are almost all state-sponsored too. I wonder if the whole spat was a ruse to get Airbus to change their pricing or some other negotiating tactic. Whatever it was, it seems to have worked.
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