Silent R's Thai to English

Thai language section, ask your language questions here.
User avatar
Big Boy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 45038
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:36 pm
Location: Bon Kai

Silent R's Thai to English

Post by Big Boy »

One of my pet hates is the way Thais put silent R's into the English spelling of Thai words.

My most recent example has come when planning a forthcoming trip South. I kept talking about Krabi (pronouncing the R) and my wife didn't have a clue what I was talking about. In the end, I typed Krabi into Google Translate, and clicked the speaker symbol on the Thai side of the screen.

My wife remarked, "Kabeeee, why didn't you say that?" :?

Can anybody explain why, when converting Thai Language to English, Thais feel obliged to put silent R's into the spelling? Is just to give them the opportunity to laugh at us when we pronounce it as its spelt? :banghead:
Championship Plymouth Argyle 0 - 1 Preston NE :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Points 41; Position 18
GLCQuantum
Rock Star
Rock Star
Posts: 3583
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:00 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by GLCQuantum »

It's a little like 'lazy Thai' I suppose. Much like the English won't pronounce the 't' in the middle or end of a word sometimes (myself included :oops: )and instead add a back of the throat sound in place of the 't' as in...

Alrigh(t) mate.. I bough(t) a new compu(t)er yesterday.

On the news, they'll pronounce the 'r' as a kinda rolling 'r'. Proper Thai I suppose. In general chit chat it's either pronounced as an 'l' or deleted altogether.

I'm no expert, but that's how I look at it. :D

:cheers:

Edit: Saying that I think your wife would have understood 'Krabiiiiii' including the 'r' but with massive emphasis on the second syllable. (Teacheeeer, Peteeerr, Hondaaaa, Terryyyyy) The Thai's are strange like that... :mrgreen:
HHTel
Hero
Hero
Posts: 10814
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:44 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by HHTel »

Yes the 'R' in Thai is a rolling 'R'. RRRRo RRRRua! You'll find, like the BBC, that on serious radio channels (and TV) the presenters will say "Krrrrap" as opposed to "Kap" which is used generally. You will even find the female 'I' pronounced as "Dichan" where in normal everyday language it is "Chan" or "Koy" (if you're from Chiang Mai).
User avatar
Bamboo Grove
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5273
Joined: Mon Jan 13, 2003 12:59 pm
Location: Macau, China

Re: Silent R's

Post by Bamboo Grove »

Did you pronounce the first part of Krabi (as crab) and then finish it with ee? Then I would understand that it had no meaning to her.
HHTel
Hero
Hero
Posts: 10814
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:44 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by HHTel »

Correctly, the 'R' would be pronounced as the scottish roll their 'R's. Krrrrabeeee.
GLCQuantum
Rock Star
Rock Star
Posts: 3583
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:00 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by GLCQuantum »

Here's a Thai saying Krabi (slow night for me... :wink: ) start video at 00:33 and she says it at 00:38. Don't forget though, that the Thai's have different accents too depending on the region they came from. :D

HHTel
Hero
Hero
Posts: 10814
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2007 7:44 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by HHTel »

But she is speaking English which can make a difference. She's learned to drop the 'Thai tones'. If you listen to the same from a Thai speaking Thai, then the pronunciation of 'Krabi' is different. It certainly shows it on some of the translation sites. I'll try to find a video to back me up!
GLCQuantum
Rock Star
Rock Star
Posts: 3583
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:00 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by GLCQuantum »

HHTel wrote:But she is speaking English which can make a difference. She's learned to drop the 'Thai tones'. If you listen to the same from a Thai speaking Thai, then the pronunciation of 'Krabi' is different. It certainly shows it on some of the translation sites. I'll try to find a video to back me up!
I disagree there HHTel.

The names of parts of Thailand, in my experience, always keep pretty much the same pronunciation regardless. How many ways have you heard a Thai say Hua Hin, or Krungthep? It's always the same whether they're speaking Thai or English.

I've been wrong before, though...

:cheers:
arcadianagain
Ace
Ace
Posts: 1748
Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Silent R's

Post by arcadianagain »

[quote="GLCQuantum.
I've been wrong before, though...

:cheers:[/quote]

Especially when inserting an apostrophe when it is not required. :twisted:
Gérard
Professional
Professional
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:36 pm
Location: Prachuap City

Re: Silent R's

Post by Gérard »

Listening to the video, I notice that the teacher says KRABI with the thai tone correct first, and then she repeats it with the "English tone", where the final syllable is stressed as Thai do for foreign words.
That makes a big difference for Thai people who will not care if the "r" is pronounced or not, but are more sensitive to the right thai tone.
So, I think that Big Boy's wife did not understand KRABI because it was pronounced "the English way".
User avatar
dtaai-maai
Hero
Hero
Posts: 14196
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: UK, Robin Hood country

Re: Silent R's

Post by dtaai-maai »

Gérard wrote:I think that Big Boy's wife did not understand KRABI because it was pronounced "the English way".
BB was probably a bit crabby at the time...
This is the way
Pleng
Legend
Legend
Posts: 2798
Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:04 am
Location: Hua Hin

Re: Silent R's Thai to English

Post by Pleng »

As others (I think) have eluded to, I don't think the R missing was the issue, it was probably the tonation that threw here. You could have probably said it with or without the R and it would have been understood if the tone was right.
User avatar
Nereus
Hero
Hero
Posts: 10900
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2007 3:01 pm
Location: Hua Hin and Bangkok

Re: Silent R's Thai to English

Post by Nereus »

Big Boy, try telling her that you are going to "Phrae" instead of Krabi, and see what the reaction is. :banghead:
May you be in heaven half an hour before the devil know`s you`re dead!
User avatar
Big Boy
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 45038
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:36 pm
Location: Bon Kai

Re: Silent R's Thai to English

Post by Big Boy »

:laugh: Don't worry, I'll teach her how to pronounce Krabi by the end of next week, or I'll leave her there :D
Championship Plymouth Argyle 0 - 1 Preston NE :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

Points 41; Position 18
TingTongJohn
Professional
Professional
Posts: 326
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2011 12:11 am
Location: Hua Hin/Vancouver

Re: Silent R's Thai to English

Post by TingTongJohn »

In the old days when I would go see my ex she was working at Carrefour in Bangkok on Ramintra road I would have to tell the Taxi
to go to "Caa foo" Raminta. SO I would mispronounce the store name (no R`S) but then I would pronounce the street name with the first R of Ramintra but not the second..What the heck?
One word is not a story but it is the beginning and end of one.
Post Reply