Vaccines - Covid 19

[HHTel]

You are correct. The above is aimed at the UK specifically. Joelle posted completely different restrictions for France which again differs from other European countries.

Wherever you intend to travel to, you have to check the restrictions for that country. There is no 'one rule for all'.

[thecolonel]

If Sinovac was "crap" why would the Big Boss of Bkk Hospital HH(Dr Pongsak, very nice man, educated in England at some very posh school) have 2 shots of it himself (+Astra) when a man in his position could easily have got Pfizer?

And why would he tell me that it's a "perfectly good vaccine" and to ignore the sentiment about it, even when he's not giving it to me, so is not fettered in any way?

Don't ask me, ask the countries that won't accept Sinovac. [Edit] It is a well known fact that many countries will not accept Sinovac, Sinopharm and AZ, so I'm not sure where your gripe is coming from.

Personally, I had Sinovac, and it seems fine for what I need, but it is totally inadequate for many.

Maybe you should be asking Dr Pongsak why he and his staff are now having AZ/Pfizer boosters to cover the inadequacies of Sinovac. Did you not ask for Pfizer because you thought it was better than AZ?

"Many countries won't accept AZ" ?!!

It is literally the most accepted vaccine worldwide by no. of countries, by a freaking mile(circa 70% more countries than anywhere else)! Careful with your facts

Re don't ask me, my point was re factual reporting not assumptive opinions based on hearsay. That's what you corrected forum members on quite recently. In short, I dont think you as a moderator should be saying this or that vaccine is "crap" and on the other say "stick to the facts, don't speculate" . Let us rabble do that and you can moderate us!!

My "gripe" therefore is I don't think you should saying Sinovac is crap when you literally don't know that it is. What you 'know' is that certain countries don't rate it. They could have other agendas, most notably it's from China!! Suffice to say its not fact, it's presumptive. And I'll take Pongsak's unfettered view on that rather than yours if you don't mind.

Re Pfizer better than AZ.... Nope. I was under the misunderstanding that Pfizer gave less/no side effects than AZ. Pongsak corrected me saying its completely dependent upon your individual body.

Finally, in respect of your original post, correct me if I'm wrong but isn't it that it's 'where' you had the vaccine rather than which one? So Pfizer in Thailand is unacceptable(to UK) because it wasn't administered in UK, EU or USA. That point to be confirmed, I'm not certain, plus of course UK may change that rule.

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[HHTel]

I think BB was referring to the combination of Sinovac/sinopharm with AZ as a second dose. Not that AZ is not accepted in various countries.

You are correct regarding the UK as I've posted. They only accept vaccines given in the UK.

[thecolonel]

I think BB was referring to the combination of Sinovac/sinopharm with AZ as a second dose. Not that AZ is not accepted in various countries.

You are correct regarding the UK as I've posted. They only accept vaccines given in the UK.

Ok, not EU or US? Will assume not then

Also, what happens to someone who goes to UK who doesn't have a qualifying vaccine program? 14 day quarantine? More jabs, if they think the ones you have are insufficient?

Thanks

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[Big Boy]

Big Boy Mode

AZ does have restrictions depending upon where manufactured/administered, but yes, those restrictions are being lifted slowly. However, they did still exist the last time I looked. Ask the members here who have held out for Pfizer because they want unrestricted travel. This hasn't happened because I said their initial vaccines were crap, it is because the Thai Government decided so based on what the receiving country requires.

Let me take you back to the original question. Why have some people had 4 vaccines? It is because their first 2 were not good enough to allow them to travel. Having received Sinovac, I did research what restrictions it would result in, and there were quite a few. None that bothered me I hasten to add.

Name dropping a doctor who has subsequently had a non-Sinovac booster shot because Sinovac wasn't good enough, but telling other people its fine, doesn't help anybody. A case of do as I say, not as I do.



If you want to query what a Moderator can and can't do, there are ways to do it, and they are detailed in the Terms and Conditions that you signed up to when you joined this forum. I can assure you that no rules have been broken, but please re-acquaint yourself with T&Cs. You may learn something. It most certainly shouldn't be discussed on an active thread, polluting a thread that others may find useful. Please discuss via PM as per the T&Cs (you are entitled to go straight to Admin if you don't want to talk to me). Further communication regarding Moderator actions on this thread will at least see your comment(s) deleted.

[thecolonel]

Big Boy Mode

AZ does have restrictions depending upon where manufactured/administered, but yes, those restrictions are being lifted slowly. However, they did still exist the last time I looked. Ask the members here who have held out for Pfizer because they want unrestricted travel. This hasn't happened because I said their initial vaccines were crap, it is because the Thai Government decided so based on what the receiving country requires.

Let me take you back to the original question. Why have some people had 4 vaccines? It is because their first 2 were not good enough to allow them to travel. Having received Sinovac, I did research what restrictions it would result in, and there were quite a few. None that bothered me I hasten to add.

Name dropping a doctor who has subsequently had a non-Sinovac booster shot because Sinovac wasn't good enough, but telling other people its fine, doesn't help anybody. A case of do as I say, not as I do.



If you want to query what a Moderator can and can't do, there are ways to do it, and they are detailed in the Terms and Conditions that you signed up to when you joined this forum. I can assure you that no rules have been broken, but please re-acquaint yourself with T&Cs. You may learn something. It most certainly shouldn't be discussed on an active thread, polluting a thread that others may find useful. Please discuss via PM as per the T&Cs (you are entitled to go straight to Admin if you don't want to talk to me). Further communication regarding Moderator actions on this thread will at least see your comment(s) deleted.

Sinovac - his comments were that it was a good vaccine and inferred there had been unfair press and propaganda.

Nothing wrong with him having the combo. He said it's just 'more' efficient used with Astra, hence the Govt roll out policy.

Answer me this, if it was "crap" why did he have *any of it* in his body?

So, as a Senior Doctor in the medical circles in Thailand, and surrounded by even more experts in this field, he decided to put said "crap'' in his body, when there were so easily the ''non-crap" vaccines available to him. Yeah, right!

Of course, naturally you, and others, will therefore deem SV to be "crap" then, which is irresponsible talk. The patient should be given the best option and if that involves mixing it so be it. If two vaccines are mixed to produce a better result, why does the first one have to be crap and the second great? This is dangerous propaganda

You are not a Doctor and certainly not an epidemiologist. You don't know, for a fact, that Sinovac is crap! How on earth would you?!

And yet you have the temerity to accuse me of "polluting the thread" !! That's utterly outrageous! If anyone is polluting the thread it's you by pretending you're an expert judge on vaccines when you're not. You are possibly the largest contributor to this forum and people are influenced by what you say. As such therefore you should be careful about your comments (nb speaking as a forum member now). You are not qualified to make such statements, in any capacity. Its not for you(nb or ANY member of this forum) to say what vaccines are or aren't "crap" especially about such an important medical issue.

[Mod Edit] Irrelevant comment removed.




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[Big Boy]

If the vaccine is so good, then please answer the question that initiated the discussion:

I notice that the vaccination stats published in the Thai Enquirer shows a stat for 4th dose!

205 yesterday for a total of 708.

What's that all about?

I've provided the actual answer. It will be interesting to hear your version.

[Dannie Boy]

Regarding the doctor choosing the Sinovac vaccine in preference to the others, when I asked the doctor who I’ve been seeing, he said that at the time he was offered the vaccine, it was only Sinovac available (2 doses), although he too has since had a third Pfizer vaccine.


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[thecolonel]

If the vaccine is so good, then please answer the question that initiated the discussion:

I notice that the vaccination stats published in the Thai Enquirer shows a stat for 4th dose!

205 yesterday for a total of 708.

What's that all about?

I've provided the actual answer. It will be interesting to hear your version.

It's abundantly to clear to anyone reading this thread that my principal comments did not relate to HHTels question that you smugly state you actually answered

My comments directly addressed you calling Sinovac "crap".

But now you mention it, there you go again with your presumptions and assumptions on topics you really don't know about. Not that I'm an expert on vaccines, that's for sure, but I know that I'm totally unqualified to call a vaccine "crap", in any manner but what is clearly an obvious joke. Especially when a Senior Medical man has without bias told me its a perfectly good vaccine

You weren't joking and even defended your assertion, even challenging the reasons why a local Senior Doctor accepted said vaccine. You just can't face the fact that you might be wrong, and it's not crap. Regardless, people on here shouldn't be saying that when it's baseless propaganda

Apart from anything, it's against the law in Thailand to spread fake news about covid 19. Stating Sinovac is crap is not exactly giving this forum a good name. That's on you.

As re 4th doses, I would strongly suggest that does not mean per se that the vaccine concerned was crap. How would you know that?!

Were all the vaccines in Israel crap? (so is Pfizer crap then?)

You don't know what you're talking about. Stop saying (& defending) that Sinovac is crap. The good people of this forum deserve better than to be "polluted" (to use your own words) by your wildly inaccurate and dangerous assumptions

https://www.timesofisrael.com/virus-cza ... cine-dose/

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[thecolonel]

Regarding the doctor choosing the Sinovac vaccine in preference to the others, when I asked the doctor who I’ve been seeing, he said that at the time he was offered the vaccine, it was only Sinovac available (2 doses), although he too has since had a third Pfizer vaccine.


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Hi Dannie

"Regarding the doctor choosing the Sinovac vaccine in preference to the others"

If you look at my comments, I never actually said that, ie he "chose it over others"

What I said was that he fully accepted it when surely a man in his powerful position could so easily have gotten 'the good stuff'. And had expert advice/opinions at his fingertips(as he employs them) and was assured SV was a good vaccine






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[buksida]

I would imagine Thai doctors operating in Thailand would have to tow the state line - which is Sinovac since the junta keeps buying it and forcing it on the population (not giving them a choice). For this one that praises it, there will be plenty that disagree (and a whole bunch of medical studies that conclude it is not very effective against delta).

[Big Boy]

My comments directly addressed you calling Sinovac "crap".

I called Sinovac crap in relation to the question, which was related to travel. Yes, if you want to travel it is hopeless.

This is not my personal view, it is the opinion of many Governments around the world, and the Thai Government does not disagree because they are complying with the wishes of these other Governments, and re-vaccinating those who need to travel for education. For travel purposes, there are many descriptive I could have used that would have meant 'crap' - apologies if the nasty word offended anybody.

I was one of the first people on this forum to accept Sinovac. I didn't accept it because it was crap. I accepted it because I understood it would probably do what I needed it to do, and combined with an AZ jab would hopefully provide the required efficacy to keep me safe. I accepted it because I have no immediate plans to travel outside of Thailand.

It is a fact that double Sinovac loses it's efficacy very quickly, so isn't really fit for purpose. This is why front line workers are having to have boosters of other vaccines, and in Thailand, Sinovac is now a definite no for hospital personnel. Of course the doctors have say Sinovac is fine, but it is so good they and their teams have to totally avoid it. Ask yourself why?

I don't claim to know any of the clever stuff (I doubt whether any of us can), but am commenting based upon what Governments and their experts are telling us e.g. if it's so good, why are much needed vaccines being used to give essential booster shots when the country is trying to vaccinate the rest of the population?

It is clear to me that you have taken my answer to HHTel's question totally out context, and have decided to attack me, rather than the question. I have no idea what Israel or Pfizer has to do with HHTel's question, but you are attempting to bring in other factors, which are not relevant to Sinovac's restrictions on travel, and I refuse to be drawn. Of course, you are in the vaccines thread, so you are perfectly entitled to debate them with anybody that wants to play.

[sateeb]

Big Boy Mode

AZ does have restrictions depending upon where manufactured/administered, but yes, those restrictions are being lifted slowly. However, they did still exist the last time I looked. Ask the members here who have held out for Pfizer because they want unrestricted travel. This hasn't happened because I said their initial vaccines were crap, it is because the Thai Government decided so based on what the receiving country requires.

Let me take you back to the original question. Why have some people had 4 vaccines? It is because their first 2 were not good enough to allow them to travel. Having received Sinovac, I did research what restrictions it would result in, and there were quite a few. None that bothered me I hasten to add.

Name dropping a doctor who has subsequently had a non-Sinovac booster shot because Sinovac wasn't good enough, but telling other people its fine, doesn't help anybody. A case of do as I say, not as I do.



If you want to query what a Moderator can and can't do, there are ways to do it, and they are detailed in the Terms and Conditions that you signed up to when you joined this forum. I can assure you that no rules have been broken, but please re-acquaint yourself with T&Cs. You may learn something. It most certainly shouldn't be discussed on an active thread, polluting a thread that others may find useful. Please discuss via PM as per the T&Cs (you are entitled to go straight to Admin if you don't want to talk to me). Further communication regarding Moderator actions on this thread will at least see your comment(s) deleted.

Sinovac - his comments were that it was a good vaccine and inferred there had been unfair press and propaganda.

Nothing wrong with him having the combo. He said it's just 'more' efficient used with Astra, hence the Govt roll out policy.

Answer me this, if it was "crap" why did he have *any of it* in his body?

So, as a Senior Doctor in the medical circles in Thailand, and surrounded by even more experts in this field, he decided to put said "crap'' in his body, when there were so easily the ''non-crap" vaccines available to him. Yeah, right!

Of course, naturally you, and others, will therefore deem SV to be "crap" then, which is irresponsible talk. The patient should be given the best option and if that involves mixing it so be it. If two vaccines are mixed to produce a better result, why does the first one have to be crap and the second great? This is dangerous propaganda

You are not a Doctor and certainly not an epidemiologist. You don't know, for a fact, that Sinovac is crap! How on earth would you?!

And yet you have the temerity to accuse me of "polluting the thread" !! That's utterly outrageous! If anyone is polluting the thread it's you by pretending you're an expert judge on vaccines when you're not. You are possibly the largest contributor to this forum and people are influenced by what you say. As such therefore you should be careful about your comments (nb speaking as a forum member now). You are not qualified to make such statements, in any capacity. Its not for you(nb or ANY member of this forum) to say what vaccines are or aren't "crap" especially about such an important medical issue.

[Mod Edit] Irrelevant comment removed.




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Not sure about you polluting the thread but you are taking the word of one doctor against all the eminent studies that suggest Sinovac has it's limitations against the Delta variant.

I remember some years ago when a neighbour of mine got ill and was admitted to hospital, another neighbour was banging on that the patient was in good hands as he was being cared for by the best doctor in Thailand in that particular field. When I asked him how he came to that conclusion he said, and I quote, "The doctor told me himself!".

Gullible much

And as for the "crap" comment, BB, to be fair, did roll in AZ as well and it was clear it was in reference to travel restrictions to Europe, particularly the UK. I don't say this often, but calm down and read thoroughly before reacting.

[HHTel]

I WISH I'D NEVER ASKED!!

[sateeb]

Isn't it strange that one word caused a "firestorm" to a relatively simple question and answer, something Forum's and social media do rather well.