U-Turns

[Big Boy]

I see that U-Turns are taking a bit of a hammering here viewtopic.php?f=44&t=31401 , so I thought a new thread may be in order.

To start with, I think we all find them very dangerous. Because of the danger, Farangs (UK drivers at least) will generally take extra care, but many Thais, especially if wearing a kickass amulet just pull out into traffic. It has been proved in the UK that the greater the danger, the less chance of an accident, because driving habits change. In my 4 years living here, I must admit, I haven't seen many accidents as the result of U-turns, but maybe I've just been lucky.

What are the alternatives?

Roundabouts? - coming from the UK, this would be my preference, but of course would require a lot of education, and a complete change in the Thai driver's mindset. I think such a change would cause more problems than we have now. I can see a road that is busy in one direction. Thais would start going around the roundabout the wrong way in order to gain 2 car places. Let's think about the basic rule on a roundabout, 'Give way to traffic from the right.' Does the phrase, 'Give Way' actually exist in a Thai driver's vocabulary?

Traffic Lights - I see they are installing several sets of traffic lights along the Klong Road to overcome many of their shortcomings on the road being too narrow to do a U-Turn. They actually tried doing little turning bays, but these are often used as parking bays. However, will people (not just Thais) obey the lights? I've been left as the only vehicle stopped at the lights outside Bangkok Hospital many times. I've had mini-buses, tuk tuks etc flashing lights, beeping horns etc because I will not run the red light.

Then, there is the additional journey time. Thai traffic lights can be painful, with 2 to 3 minutes at each set of lights. Sequencing lights properly also seems to be a skill that Thais have never learned, so 4 sets of lights can easily add 10 minutes to a relatively short journey. I've already discuss how Thais will go the wrong way around a roundabout to gain 2 car lengths - I'm sure they would soon find a way around stopping at traffic lights. If they put lights at every U-turn from here to Bangkok, just imagine the mayhem.

If any of you have tried doing Kanchanaburi to Hua Hin during rush hour, you will realise how much longer it can take if you hit the traffic lights wrong - an extra hour on the journey is not uncommon.

So, what is the answer?

[hhinner]

My opinions for what they're worth.

I've seen the new lights on the khlong road and wondered what's the point? After all it's not exactly the busiest road in Hua Hin, especially where the lights are being installed. There are at least two other places on the khlong road where lights would actually be useful. And I'm sure many people can think of other roads where lights are actually needed.

The roundabout at Palm Hills works fine, and there are a few in Phetchaburi that seem OK as well. They also slow everything down because most people seem unsure about who has right of way. The crazy roundabout on Chomsin Rd in Hua Hin should probably be replaced by lights as well because given the traffic flows it just doesn't work.


As for u-turns on main roads, the sooner they can be got rid of or somehow made safer the better. I've seen many near accidents on Phetkasem between airport and palace because drivers u-turning in opposite directions block each others' view, and other traffic is doing 100 kph or more (though it's a 60 limit).

[bsdk1960]

Well, imoh roundabouts could be a good alternative. if people know how to use them, but how should thais know with the traffic education they learn from the day thy are born.

the 2 new on Klong road is way to small ,if you learn the roundabout you could drive over in the bicycle lane and just move along with more than 100 km per hour,there will come some accident there because you dont have to slow down,Im just happy I dont live in that townhouse on the corner were some idiot will land one day when he comming from north and going south

[oakdale160]

I think the most pathetic oneis the one on theeaster end of Soi 112. It is really justa piece of tarmac, less high than a sped bump. np teal signage, no pinted arrows. Some cars drive straight over it.
Roundabouts are not easy for the uninitiated even in western countries, They were almost unknown in the Us until a few years ago, and the citie sthat have built them have had to work to educate the drivers.

[HHTel]

The roundabout on 112 has been modified for some time now. Arrows all around the centre of the roundabout and a tall light cluster in the centre lighting up the roundabout. Anyone trying to go over it has to be blind and will run straight into the central structure!

Roadsigns are their from whatever direction. Diagrams are painted on the road. The rule (give way to traffic on the roundabout) is signed in Thai from all directions. No excuse at all but still the Thais get it wrong.

[Big Boy]

But the question has to be, "Do they get it wrong through ignorance, or because they want to?"

[Bristolian]

But the question has to be, "Do they get it wrong through ignorance, or because they want to?"

Simply because they CAN (most important person goes first)

[Simijim]

New traffic lights on Klong road, I have to agree that I have no idea as to why. Round abouts in jeneral nobody ises correctly except in the UK. I have seen locals and foreigners just drive through not fiving way or stopping to on coming traffic. Arab countries I have lived in, round abouts are just a modified stop on a through fair.

I like to drive safely for myself and familys preservation, but lets face it the local culture does not care about safety only how to get from point A to point B fast. If people really cared then they would not carry babies on motorbikes and drive like no one else is on the road!
That being said it is easy to get caught up in doing it like the locals or complaining all the time. I am finding it is best to egnore and deive safe.

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[Jack Sprat]

I'm in favour of roundabouts...
I'm not sure if my memory serves me correctly, but didn't the UK government/DVLC run a series of adverts on TV for several months, showing people how to use a roundabout?
Perhaps the Thai government (when they eventually get one) should adopt this approach and run informational videos for a year or so, especially at peak viewing times, to try and educate the masses.
Of course, this is a small problem in a much larger issue......educating people how to drive in the first place, and enforcing penalties for offenders would be a great start......but then again you need to have a competent police force that are capable of enforcing such rules.....alas, a huge problem facing an emerging 3rd world country that doesn't have a cat in hells chance whilst there is no democratically elected government....I digress....

[Arlo]

Up in Udon they have a few roundabouts in the city. The people up there seem to have figured it out. Also in Bangkok I think Victory Monument is also a roundabout so this idea wouldn't be a new thing.

[Big Boy]

They've got a few around this area also, but they are a joke.

The funniest I saw was when the BIB set up a roadblock on the crazy railway crossing. All motorcyclists without helmets (so as you can guess, there were a few) simply went around the roundabout in the wrong direction to avoid them. This caused absolute mayhem, but not a single BIB left his post to do anything about it.

[oakdale160]

Police effectiveness story. A city in south china, the traffic was crazy, driving on curbs, through red lights etc etc. The mayor had been onto the police with no effect. He went to a meeting in HK on some other matter. He came back called in the the police and said -good news. I have arranged for a team of police from HK to come fora month and teach you how to control traffic. The next day the police were out working like animals on the problem. Stopping offenders, fining them, beating them etc. In a week the trafic was under perfect control. If there was a way to threaten Thai police with loss of face that would do it, nothing else.

[usual suspect]

..What really annoys me about the U-turns is the way they've 'kinked' the straight-on lanes to the left to accomodate the turn..folk really have to be aware of this when say you're in the right lane going slightly faster than the left..see the lane-markings veer to the left..check your mirror & hope/pray the motorist at the side of you has seen this direction change also..

THEN..as the lanes go to the left..what if there's a cyclist or motorcycle is in the cycle-lane just at that time..?
The cycle lane disappears at these U-turns leaving the two-wheelers right in the firing-line of the vehicles moving across..

SO..you've made your U-turn, now it's time to join the main flow of traffic in the time/distance allocated by the short acceleration-lane..Oh no..remember you are about to make a Thai driver give way/yield..here's where you HAVE to barge your way in or be stuck forever.

Personally Petkasem Rd south to the flyover from the centre is one of the most mentally taxing stretches of Rd around..
..We have the U-turns, lane changes as mentioned, we have fast,'pushy' motorists needing to blast out of town, we have motorbike/sidecars trundling along at 20kph, (also the orange buses crawling along), we have the building sites with all manor of vehicles either parked up, turning in/out, or backing in/out, those damn traffic lights at BKK hospital, THEN a possible MiB checkpoint at Condo Chain...When you DO reach the flyover you feel a sense of liberty & motoring freedom wash over you.
Maybe blocking off the U-turns is not such a bad thing after all..?

[Big Boy]

Personally Petkasem Rd south to the flyover from the centre is one of the most mentally taxing stretches of Rd around..
..We have the U-turns, lane changes as mentioned, we have fast,'pushy' motorists needing to blast out of town, we have motorbike/sidecars trundling along at 20kph, (also the orange buses crawling along), we have the building sites with all manor of vehicles either parked up, turning in/out, or backing in/out, those damn traffic lights at BKK hospital, THEN a possible MiB checkpoint at Condo Chain...When you DO reach the flyover you feel a sense of liberty & motoring freedom wash over you.
Maybe blocking off the U-turns is not such a bad thing after all..?

You missed the mini-buses suddenly switching from right to left, and double parking in the hope of a passer by being a potential customer.

[Ratsima]

Roundabouts depend on people knowing and following the right-of-way rules.

There are frequent accidents on Petkasem Rd at the U-turns in the vicinity of The Energy, both north and south. The was a horrendous one at the entrance of the Grand Condotel last week. That same week one of my wife's law clients reported another one at the PTT station just south of the Energy. He noted that a friend of his was killed in an accident at the same spot early last year.

My old friend Dan (a former member here) was killed a bit further south at a U-turn while he was standing on the side of the road with his bicycle.

I think that closing most of the U-turns and installing signals would be a big help. People who are in a huge hurry should take Hwy 37.